fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4071 ]

[ SECRET POST #4071 ]

⌈ Secret Post #4071 ⌋

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Watching this show.

You know how the federation is a post scarcity, post currency society? Money is an outdated concept, and people don't work because they need to work to live, but rather they work achieve their greatest self and to better themselves and help advance the world...

I get all that. I get where Will Riker and Picard and even Guinan come from.

Why do the people who mop Rikers Jizz out of the Holodeck do what they do? No-ones paying them, They're not bettering society, they are at best keeping Riker from worsening society. At least the part of society that uses the Holodeck after him.

I mean, that's just the worst part of it, but honestly, Risa wait staff? Why have they opted to become wait staff?

And hell, since I mentioned Guinan, while I get her vaule to the ship is far beyond that of a bartender, Why the fuck do they even need a bartender? Food is replicated instantly by the compter and the replicators. The crew could - And frequently DOES go up to replicators, make their demand, and walk away instantly with the food or drink of their choosing.

Is this really what happends?

Riker: *Approches Bar staff* Taco please
Bar Staff: *Goes to the replicator behind the bar" Taco please *Brings taco to Riker"
Riker: Thanks

And this is their job? Their job no-one is paying them to do? That they do for the sheer job satisfaction?

I used to love the idea of living in the Star Trek universe, but no... No it sounds like a torturous place. You're not even a wage slave over there. You're... furniture. You're... zombies, willing living zombies...

Edited 2018-02-25 22:15 (UTC)

Could be like a librarian for food. The person remembers what specific tastes each person likes and comes up with combinations of them, or recs things.

Star Trek technology might be advanced but I don't think they're "read my mind and know exactly what combinations of toppings in what proportions I mean when I say 'pizza'" advanced.

Like I say, I get guinan, guinan has value beyond her "Dish out food" role, but why the rest of the wait staff?

Idk, maybe it was the least amount of work and responsibility needed to be aboard a spaceship seeing the universe. I assume they don't let just any random tourists who do nothing useful on board, even if money isn't a thing.

Plus in a world where you're not being waitstaff for money and money isn't a thing, they probably treat them a lot better than waitstaff is treated now.

Well, the other main job of a bartender is a combination sympathetic ear/agony aunt. Guinan is basically the ship's unofficial counselor and let's face it... if I had a problem, I'd go to her before I visited Troi.

She also has a stash of unusual stuff behind the bar, including real booze instead of synthahol, so there's that, too.

Agreed, but not every bar is run by GUinan. What is the value of having an actual bar? No need to pay, no need to give your orders to a person, no need for any of it. Guinan personally adds the value, but the idea of a bar should be as long forgotten as money

I assume it's for the weirdos who enjoy more drawn out personal interaction vs. a quick, impersonal transaction. I'm generally in the latter category, myself.

social reasons, same reason I'd rather go to a bar than sit at home alone and drink.

It's Starfleet. If it's like any other military outfit in the history of people grouping together to shoot at each other, the janitors are junior enlisted. You start in Holodeck mop-up and eventually move into Holodeck maintenance and repair until the holograms turn evil and through you out of an airlock.

Maybe it's just one way to avoid being bored to death. It's not like anyone has to work for a living, so you have to come up with something else to do, and not everyone likes hobbies or is smart enough to get a better job. Would it even be possible to be drunk all day, since they got rid of actual alcohol?

Sounds like DS9 would be more your speed.

This is p much the question you have to ask about any futuristic economy, isnt it? Like, the universal living wage ideas getting thrown around.

Who will choose to be a janitor? A septic tank cleaner? A roofer?

We know the value of their labor in our current society (sometimes a LOT, sometimes barely min wage). People do tjose jobs bc they get paid, not bc its so much fun.

I'm on my third 20 hr shift this weekend bc thats the kind of labor my job requires. Who the fuck would do this for free??? Or rather, for the "satisfaction" or "fulfilment" it might bring? Fucking nobody.

I love the idea of the star trek utopian future, but i just dk how tf it would work.

You build septic tanks that clean themselves and roofs that clean themselves, and everyone can have them, because the Federation in Star Trek is pretty much post-scarcity.

Obviously, Star Trek never really thinks about the implications of being a post-scarcity economy, because Star Trek stories mostly aren't about that. But, like, in general, I would say that the kinds of questions that you're asking just aren't that difficult to answer under those specific conditions.

My problem with that being the answer ("things that magically maintain themselves" I mean) is that it makes the whole 'verse incredibly inconsistent. It's a world with replicators and self-cleaning toilets, but we see that the world still needs engineers and pilots and linguists and doctors and stuff.

Like, in the real world we're closer to fully automated surgery (with micro robots and lasers and AI-driven scalpels) than we are to self-tiling roofs. We can store the entire knowledge of the human race in a device smaller than the palm of our hand, but our floors don't mop themselves.

Obviously a lot of the inconsistencies in the star trek tech are due to the fact that it came out so long ago and they couldn't possibly have predicted what technologies were likely to take off. But to me it's just hard to buy into the fiction when there's so much contradictory stuff. Because really, who would want to be a waiter? And if you need engineers and pilots and doctors, then they probably still need septic tank workers, too.

Yeah. I assume that they mostly have waiters because a given story needed a waiter, and the actual details of what a post-scarcity economy fall into the category of "science-fiction things Trek writers try actively not to think about or engage with", like the mechanics of FTL travel, or the idea of artificial intelligence (except for Data).

I think replicators usually offer up synthehol, though they can be adjusted for real alcohol, I think you may need to be senior staff or something. Also, the replicators keep track of stuff and I wouldn't be surprised if there's some sort of report, if only to keep track of energy used. And I think wait staff at any place would be more for cleaning up after people and if there are issues - so combination bussing, concierge services, and security.

Riker: *Approches Bar staff* Taco please
Bar Staff: *Goes to the replicator behind the bar" Taco please *Brings taco to Riker"
Riker: Thanks

It's like Gwen DeMarco's job but with tacos.

I just kind of hand-wave it as it's not quite post-scarcity in the sense that no one would bother to get a job, but more like there's universal income or something so that no one is poor, but if you want a nicer house or the opportunity to travel or whatever, you find a paying job. Also, like others said, these could be enlisted personnel or folks who just wanted the change to explore space.

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[ SECRET POST #4071 ]

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