fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #585 ]

⌈ Secret Post #585 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 12 pages, 280 secrets from Secret Submission Post #084.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 4 - not!secrets ], [ 1 2 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 - take it to comments ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I'll have to disagree. To reduce Batman's vigilantism and strict moral code to something as simple as "he's breaking oodles of laws but can't break one more and kill the Joker" is to miss the point. Batman knows the system is corrupt (political figures are shady, every other Gotham cop is on the take), but he refuses to kill because he (and Jim Gordon) want to believe so badly that the system, in the end, does work. If -Batman- gives up on justice, who and what is left to believe in?

The truth is, I think Batman's as crazy as anyone else in his Rogue's Gallery, and that it's less about Justice for the city as it is a personal vendetta. Of all things, it was Batman Forever that made me think that, but I think it's just that he's still taking down criminals because something Very Bad happened to him when he was a kid. I mean, it's much, much more complex than that, and I know it is.
Gordon wants to believe the system works. Batman just wants balm on his well-nursed wounds. I think he says it's for justice, and that he's said it often enough that he believes it, but really, he's fooling himself.
Pragmatically, it's a good thing he is and all, given the good he's done for Gotham. But purely clinically? He's nuts.

Killing the Joker wouldn't be giving up on justice either, I don't think. Batman's scared of what he'd become if he let himself do it, and I'll admit with good reason, but I still think it's either weak or self-indulgent that he won't do it, especially since he knows (and has told the Joker as much) that it will have to end with one of their death's. He knows the Joker can't be helped or contained, so in a way, he's either putting off the inevitable, or hoping that someone else will wind up doing it for him.

He can't believe that the system works and do what he does, pure and simple. He'd like to think that, I suppose, but he takes himself out of the system, meaning that the only rules that apply to him are the ones he sets himself. His "strict moral code" is just something he has to make himself feel better about that and everything. I suppose you could be a little melodramatic and say that's what seperates him from them (although cops, even non-corrupt ones, will shoot to kill if dealing with a psycho like the Joker. So what's the deal, Batsy?), but I keep thinking of something Wolverine told Chamber when the latter was told to infiltrate Weapon X. I can't remember what he said exactly, but it was something along the lines of "This is something that needs doing and it isn't pretty or glamourous, but if you've got a chance to save hundreds of lives and the cost is a piece of your soul, you pay it."

It's not something I agree with 100% IRL, but in comic/story-logic, I do.

(And yes, I agree, comic-wise, Batman can't kill someone, and I'm not sure that I'd want him to. But playing pure devil's advocate...I still think he's nuts and a little spoiled.)

You raise very good points. Batman can't do what he does without being a little crazy himself, and time and again the residents of Arkham have tried to prove that. However, I've always felt the key difference between Batman and most of the Rogues Gallery is that Batman, while crazy in his own way, still has the power to say no. NO, I will not hurt this person any more than is necessary in order to gain information. NO, I will not murder in cold blood. Many members of the Rogues Gallery are too far gone in their insanity to make a conscious choice anymore (though I suppose you can still argue that the Joker's level of insanity surpasses insanity itself and becomes that "super-sanity" that Morrison talks about in Arkham Asylum).

He can't believe that the system works and do what he does, pure and simple.

I agree with this in part because I can see how hard it would be to reconcile the two, but I think Batman believes in justice more as an abstract concept, while at the same time he makes up his own justice to fill in the gaps.

I still think he's nuts and a little spoiled

Ahahaha, spoiled definitely. Most orphans don't have a billion-dollar company and a gigantic trust fund at their disposal.

[ SECRET POST #585 ]

Re: 148

Re: 148

Re: 148