fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #596 ]

⌈ Secret Post #596 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 24 pages, 597 secrets from Secret Submission Post #086.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 4 - not!secrets ], [ 1 2 3 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 - repeat ], [ 1 - not a secret but worth reading ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Uh huh.

Swap "gay person" with "black person" and see how well that sits with you.

Yeah, I was thinking much along the same lines there. o_o

Exactly what I did. Then "Jew" and "woman". *shudder*

Yup. I'm assuming troll (out of charitable feelings towards humanity, perhaps).

A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position. To "set up a straw man" or "set up a straw man argument" is to describe a position that superficially resembles an opponent's actual view but is easier to refute, then attribute that position to the opponent (for example, deliberately overstating the opponent's position). A straw man argument can be a successful rhetorical technique (that is, it may succeed in persuading people) but it carries little or no real evidential weight, because the opponent's actual argument has not been refuted.

Except it wasn't a strawman argument. it's pointing out that the very phrasing used was bigoted in a way that would make the prejudicial terms stand out more strakly.

If you say so.

Can you support the position that "I like to watch [oppressed subset of people] fuck, but I don't want to be their friends, because they're all jerks" isn't bigoted? Because if so, I'd like to hear it.

Yeah.

Well, how about this:

It is not okay to dismiss an entire group of people -- let alone a group which has NOTHING in common other than sexual preference (which the OP may or may not actually know anything about, mind you) -- based on having met a handful of its members.

Clear enough for you?

You know, you can't just guilt people into liking things that they just don't like. including different kinds of people. The OP didn't say that he didn't accept their choices, just that he didn't want to be friends with any of the ones he's met, so he assumes that he's not going to like any of them. All people have little biases like that. It's better if we just admit these things and get over them already.

Because wanting an oppressed minority to be sex objects for you, but dismissing all of them as not worth knowing totally isn't bigoted.

Wait, wait, wait - so it only matters if they're "an oppressed minorty"? So it's okay if you don't want to get to know straight white men personally, but like watching them have sex?

I'm going to go bang my head against a wall instead of having this conversation, kay?

If you don't get the difference between saying something like the secret about a group of people who habitually get treated as objects and less-than-human and saying it about the group that holds the most power in our culture, I can't help you.

And if you can't get the fact that you're just increasing their status as objects-less-than-human by insisting on seperating them and treating them differently than the majority, then you're really not worth talking to either.

I think the point is that no one should be dismissed that way.

Re: 177

geministar01.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 02:31 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-24 03:17 (UTC) - Expand

geministar01.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 03:36 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-24 03:59 (UTC) - Expand

geministar01.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 04:08 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-24 14:52 (UTC) - Expand

geministar01.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 16:14 (UTC) - Expand

fenm.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 05:47 (UTC) - Expand

geministar01.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 05:54 (UTC) - Expand

The OP didn't say that he didn't accept their choices, just that he didn't want to be friends with any of the ones he's met, so he assumes that he's not going to like any of them

He IS saying more than that, actually: He doesn't want to be their friends--but he wants to watch them have sex. How is that not more than a little fucked up?

BTW, how is this secret fandom...?

I dunno. I don't want to be friends with random anime characters, but I still enjoy hentai on occasion. For that matter, a couple hundred thousand people in the world enjoy watching total strangers have sex, even though they would never dream about getting to know them personally, and nobody really has a problem with that particular part of the porn industry.

BTW, I would say the secret is fandom because the post refers to writing lots of slash fic.

That is one hell of an assumption for the OP to make. Not only that they know which of the people they've previously met are gay, but that the openly gay people are somehow representative of you know...hundreds of thousands of other human beings who may have nothing but their sexual preferences in common with each other.

*looks up at 177*

*looks at this thread*

*looks at 177*

*looks back at thread*

*is so very, very confused*

Me too! What am I missing? *scratches head*

It's one of those things where a person posts a troll secret, waits for enough "funny" responses, then swaps out the image file for something completely different.

I was totally lost and confused. I kept wondering what was getting everyone's dander up!

It said something along the lines of "I don't like gay people, they're all assholes. But I want them to fuck in front of me. I'm a slash writer." :/

Oh, well, that's suitably horrible.

ryuutchi.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 01:27 (UTC) - Expand

littlewings04.livejournal.com - 2008-08-24 01:29 (UTC) - Expand

me too. I suspect it's another bait and switch secret.