fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4431 ]

[ SECRET POST #4431 ]

⌈ Secret Post #4431 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 11 secrets from Secret Submission Post #634.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

The quote in OP's secret accuses straight women of being hypocritical for saying they don't go for femslash because they can't relate to it. But there's nothing hypocritical about that. I can't relate to being sexually attracted to, falling in romantic love with, and wanting to fuck another woman. Nor can I really relate to feeling sexually and emotionally aroused by the knowledge that another woman desires/loves me.

I can relate to being sexually attracted to, falling in romantic love with, and wanting to fuck a man. And I can relate to feeling sexually and emotionally aroused by the knowledge that a man desires/loves me.

So in that way, slash is not just relatable, it can actually be doubly relatable. Because with slash, I can relate to both men's feelings/desires for each other, and both men's feelings about being desired by the other.

... so you can't relate to something you haven't experienced personally? how... do you enjoy fiction, then?

honest question, because i don't understand this at all.

Not the AYRT but for maybe some people romance/sex stories are harder to enjoy without that ability to relate (even a little), while with crime/fantasy/etc stories there's already that implication that this isn't going to be very relatable and that's okay for that type story?

I can't vicariously experience the hot, sexy pleasure of wanting to fuck a woman. Because I don't want to fuck women. Or if I can vicariously experience it at all, it's only in a vague, watered-down kind of way. A little bit of that feeling comes through, but it's more abstract. More an understanding than a feeling.

You gonna sit there and tell me that you, Mr. I Only Like Slash Because I'm Gay, do vicariously experience the hot, sexy pleasure of wanting to fuck a woman? Surely you can relate to something you haven't experienced personally, after all.

i'm not the op of this thread and i'm neither gay nor a man, but... no? i don't consume media to vicariously experience things, i consume it because i'm invested in the characters and the story and i want to read about their experiences and their feelings, not bring my own into it. tbh i find it a little creepy that so many people apparently do get this personally invested in fiction, but i suppose that explains things like shipping wars.

i don't consume media to vicariously experience things, i consume it because i'm invested in the characters and the story and i want to read about their experiences and their feelings

That...sounds like vicarious experience to me.

Like, you care about what happens to the characters. Why? Because you have empathy with them - i.e. when stuff happens to them, you feel it. That is vicarious experience. Vicarious experience is what makes fiction engaging in the first place. We care because what's happening in the story impacts us emotionally, even though it's not actually happening to us.

DA - Vicariously following emotional story beats is a completely different level from only connecting to characters you can physically switch yourself out with entirely.

i can't understand wanting to have hot sweaty sex with a man, but i absolutely can understand someone falling in love with another person because that's a universal experience.

Good for you. I just so happen to be a hell of a lot more attracted to that universal experience when it involves at least one man. Because that's a lot more relatable to me. Because I'm het. Honestly, it's really not at all complicated or difficult to understand.

lmfao holee shit

this comment made me die inside

I'm not het so maybe I'm missing some nuance here but...surely your emotional investment doesn't WHOLLY revolve around a man being present?

THIS. THIS. THIS.

like god forbid I, a straight woman who is attracted to cock and to maleness, want some cock and some maleness in my fictional sexytiems. That's crazy! *eyeroll.*

Lol, yup. I mean, you could pretty much have this same argument about any other sexual thing that some people are into reading and some people aren't.

Person A: Why aren't you into [literally any type of sex or kink]?
Berson B: Because [stated type of sex or kink] doesn't turn me on.
Person A: But it's fiction, and it gives the characters pleasure, and pleasure is a ~universal experience~, so can't you just imagine [stated type of sex or kink] turns you on?
Person B (who - shock, gasp - is totally me negl): I would rather just read what turns me on. But if you want to read stuff that doesn't turn you on and imagine that it does, knock yourself out.

Person B (who - shock, gasp - is totally me negl)

AYRT - I would like to be person B too please sign me up. And yeah, when it comes to sex there are plenty of things people just don't find arousing even if the character in the story does. That's why all smut doesn't work for everyone, you know?

Then say that you want to read about cock, not that you ~~~can't relate~~~ to lesbian relationships.

nayrt but I think you're interpreting "can't relate" on some kind of personal level, when in this case, it clearly just refers to what you relate to in terms of your sexual desires and romantic fantasies. It certainly doesn't mean "lesbians are alien people I do not understand them."

It clearly just refers to what you relate to in terms of your sexual desires and romantic fantasies

I understand that's what people mean by it - it's pretty clear from this thread. I don't think that's clearly what it means. If you say that you can't relate to something, without specifying why, my first thought is not necessarily going to be that you can't relate to it specifically in terms of your sexual desires. My first thought would probably be that you're saying that you can't relate to the characters or the people as people. I don't think it's an unreasonable interpretation by any means.

The context is shipping. Shipping means to enjoy a relationship between two characters, largely in fanworks that are focused on the relationship. How do you not see that "relate" clearly means relating in terms of sexual/romantic desire?

If someone said they couldn't relate to a character because she was a lesbian, that would be side eye worthy because hopefully there's more to the character than being a lesbian. But you can like the character and still be bored by fics focused on her romantic relationship with another woman because you can't relate to that part of her character.

Shipping means to enjoy a relationship between two characters, largely in fanworks that are focused on the relationship. How do you not see that "relate" clearly means relating in terms of sexual/romantic desire?

You can enjoy a relationship between two characters without feeling sexual or romantic desire for at least one of the characters involved. I don't think that there's anything wrong if that's not your personal preference. I just don't think that it's as clear and unmistakable and obvious as you do. It's the kind of miscommunication that happens between people.

You can enjoy a relationship between two characters without feeling sexual or romantic desire for at least one of the characters involved.

DA - This is very true. I'm barely attracted at all, on a personal level, to either of the characters in my OTP of the last seven years. However, what I am attracted to - very, VERY attracted to - is their relationship. I vibe with their relationship so damn hard.

And what I've found, over the years, is that I just don't vibe with f/f ships very hard. I'm just not attracted to the relationship between the characters. The part of my brain that gets turned on by stuff is just like, "What they have is cool and beautiful and great and seriously, good for them, but dude, you know this isn't our flavor."

Yeah, I'm just sitting here feeling baffled by this entire thread because to me, shipping in fiction and my own personal fantasies are two completely separate things. Like, in my current fandom, I ship A & B but the character I would personally want to bang is character C. A & B are cute together and I love their relationship so I'm all about that ship even though I'm not sexually attracted to either one of them at all. I can't imagine only being interested in ships where I'm personally attracted to one or both characters involved.

I think you're interpreting "can't relate" on some kind of personal level, when in this case, it clearly just refers to what you relate to in terms of your sexual desires and romantic fantasies. It certainly doesn't mean "lesbians are alien people I do not understand them."

DA - I completely agree with this. Honestly, outside of this thread where I'm trying to discuss the secret on its terms, I don't say I "can't relate" to f/f pairings; that's not how I personally choose to explain my preferences. However, I think if I saw another het woman explaining her preferences that way, I would understand what she was saying just fine.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #4431 ]

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