fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4530 ]

[ SECRET POST #4530 ]

⌈ Secret Post #4530 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 42 secrets from Secret Submission Post #649.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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Funny, because that's how I feel about Steve and why I can't stand MCU movies anymore. Steve is so very flawed and only says, whoops! People died! But doesn't even admit he's flawed, whereas Tony at least admits he's flawed and tries to atone for his mistakes. Gotta start somewhere, and Steve isn't even pretending to try.

It's always like zero to CAP VS IRONMAN in 30 seconds in this place...

DA - I'd say this happens in many places when discussing either of these characters, and I blame Civil War for most of it (and all the associated Team Cap vs Team Iron Man crap from the promotion of the movie).

... usually because some anon brings up Cap even if Cap hasn't been mentioned...

Yeppp...

LOL! Yep!

Seriously, it's like "Oh you said one teensy tiny criticism of Tony? YOU MUST BE A CAP FAN/STUCKY SHIPPER WHO'S JUST BITTER BLAH BLAH BLAH"... It's so weird to me that there are people out there who think that Tony is so perfect that there's absolutely no reason to dislike him as a character unless someone has a secret agenda.

+1000

Ding ding ding!

Nah, look at the reacton here, everyone is like - no Tony is worse, with people being very defensive. I think it's about the same for the T and S fans.

No one cares about Steve, they just hate Tony.

What are Steve's flaws that are to the level of Tony's flaws and have caused as many actual deaths as Tony's has?

Not the person you replied to but not killing Vision when it was first suggested resulting in half the population getting wiped out was pretty big lmao. Also at least Tony owned up to his mistakes while Steve was still trying to take other countries affairs into his own hands with no regard for the laws or casualties along the way.

Steve never said "yeah those Sokovia deaths were the our fault" he was just "lol shit happens".

The Sokovia deaths were not their fault. They were Tony's fault. He built the murder robot after everyone (including Steve) told him not to.

Killing Vision was rightfully the very last resort. They had another option. Trying to get the stone removed in Wakanda was a perfectly reasonable and morally justified decision. Just because it ended up not working out doesn't mean Steve did anything wrong or has some big mistake to own up to.

Hell, even if it wasn't his fault, he was still trying to repent for what happened as seen in Endgame.

DA
Making Ultron was a logical answer to a vision about alien invaders sent by Wanda. Just because it didn't work out doesn't mean Tony did anything wrong or has some big mistake to own up to.

even if we concede that it was "logical", which I don't

Tony's mistake was not in wanting to protect the world from attack. It was deliberately concealing a highly risky move from the team, resulting in nobody without magic anxiety nightmares being able to say, hmmm, this maybe requires more safeguards before implementation.

Bruce's character assassination aside.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2019-06-02 04:00 (UTC) - Expand

Hm? Steve very clearly has a character arc that doesn't go backwards until the last 5 mins of Endgame that make no sense.

He becomes disillusioned with the government and that is carried along through the rest of the movies. He becomes more comfortable with the future. He learns to go after things he wants.

When does he say, "Whoops! People died"?

When does he say, "Whoops! People died"?

All those deaths in Sokovia and Tony/Natasha/Rhody said they need to own up to their mistakes. Also after the Thanos snap that could have been prevented by just destroying the stone earlier on and not in front of Thanos.

Literally, none of that is "Whoops! People died". Steve was fine with owning up to mistakes. He was NOT fine with how the Accords were written and pushed thru. Frankly, considering how nobody abides by them, it doesn't seem like anyone likes how they were written. Including one of the main proponents of it. Seemingly the only outcome of the Accords was that it allows the government to arrest anyone without due process and send them to a black site.

He also didn't like Ross blaming all the deaths that happened in previous events on them. As if the deaths in New York were their fault.

Also, why should anyone but Tony (and maybe Bruce) have to own up to the deaths in Sokovia. It was THEIR fault it happened. Steve and the others told them Ultron was a bad idea.

Not sure how you can blame Steve for not seeing the future and murdering a loved one just in case. What if Thanos had never come and they had killed Vision for no reason? That seems like more of a "Whoops!"

Let's also remember that the deaths in New York could have been higher if (1) Cap hadn't instructed the first responders to put up a perimeter & evacuate civilians, and (2) the World Council nuclear bomb hadn't been shoved in the portal by IRon Man. Ross blaming the Avengers for the deaths was disingenuous.

Also it's not like the Avengers could have prevented the attack from happening in the first place. SHIELD was the one that dropped the ball there.

I always wondered who would have taken the fall if Wanda didn't redirect that explosion and Cap and the people on the ground died instead?

That is the one thing that always boggles my mind. "Wanda killed all those people in that building."

But...there were way more people on the ground that would have died instead.

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