[ SECRET POST #642 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #642 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

CITY STUFF → http://lolbuttsex.myminicity.com (I love you chatbox people)

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 147 secrets from Secret Submission Post #092.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ], [ 1 - what ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Re: 141

[cleverthylacine]

...she's not being bitchy because some people prefer het, she's annoyed that people think that it's all exactly the same...

Re: 141

[childings.livejournal.com]

OP is saying it's exactly the same thing to break up a het relationship to write slash as it is to break up a gay relationship to write het

BECAUSE IT IS

Re: 141

[cleverthylacine]

One reinforces cultural heteronormativity. One doesn't.

I don't personally think breaking up canon ships for fanfic is ever OMGWRONG and bad, because fanfic is not canon and couldn't be even if it tried. But I don't think that you are a huge hypocrite if you think it's more wrong to break up ships in a way that reinforces heteronormativity than it is to break up ships in a way that doesn't.

Re: 141

[paperclipchains.livejournal.com]

Why? There are so many variables.

Does the het couple in question reinforce heteronormative roles?
Are you casting the slash couple in traditionally het roles?
Are you demonizing one of the partners when you break up the couple?

It's ridiculous and your statement is basically just saying that slash > het. The existence of a het couple is not, in and of itself, reinforcing anything.

Re: 141

[(Anonymous)]

The existence of a het couple is not.

However, implying "this (homosexual) couple should be taken apart and recast to pair up and become a (heterosexual) couple" reinforces the view that the "better" couple is the straight one. Yes, likewise, reversing it reverses that -- implies that the "better" couple is the gay one. However, implying that straight is better than gay falls into the dominant heteronormative societal expectations, while the other suberts it. It doesn't mean, technically, either couple IS better, but it's like -- it's the same problem as making a strong independant female character a housewife in post-series fic or whatever. There's nothing wrong with housewives, but it plays into the image of the housewife as the ultimate fate for all women everywhere, aka, is antifeminist. The fic itself might be great, and it might be an awesome read, but it still falls into that social dialog. Regardless of the things you listed there, breaking up a canon gay couple to put them into heterosexual relationsihps plays into the heteronormative dialogue, while breaking up a canon straight couple steps away from that heteronormative dialogue. It may not SUBVERT heteronormativity, depending on things like the questions you asked, but the fact still remains that it's different.

It's not ridiculous. Yeah, if you rephrase the question to "the existence of a het couple", but that's not the problem here. It's the choice to break up the prior relationship to recast it -- they talk in different ways to the dominant dialogues of heteronormativity. And if they talk in different ways, it's different.

Re: 141

[paperclipchains.livejournal.com]

I've heard all of that before and I think the best way to respond is to just say that I don't believe it. That explanation ignores the context of shipping and fanfiction, the context of relationships, and assumes that slash is politically conscious more than it is fetishization of homosexuality - and fetishization isn't subversive.

Re: 141

[cuziambadass.livejournal.com]

oh, I get that. believe me I do. problem is, that's still a very broad generalization. people often assume that when a FANfiction writer break up a gay relationship to write het she/he reinforces cultural heteronormativity.

I've always heard that accusation, always... never mind that the writer is gay or bi her/himself! or that they are straight but prefers slash way more than het.

so yes, even though I believe it may be justified, when it comes to shiping and fandom in general it IS hypocritical and unfair.

Re: 141

[cuziambadass.livejournal.com]

'fuck you very much' strikes me as bitchy :/

I can understand being defensive about gay relationships (hell, I usually get overly defensive about it myself). but people often fail to understand that breaking up a gay couple, be it canon or not, to write het doesn't and shouldn't always mean that the writer is denying the existence of said couple or trying to reinforces cultural heteronormativity. I'm sorry, but that accusation really pisses me off.