fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4647 ]

[ SECRET POST #4647 ]

⌈ Secret Post #4647 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 07 secrets from Secret Submission Post #665.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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04. https://i.imgur.com/gLPKxQv.png

Whether it's able to sustain that level of analysis or not depends entirely on how the show presents them, not whether or not "it's made for 8 year olds". The two are unrelated.

The show example in the secret presents them as rock people from outer space. Realism doesn't apply.

Unrealistic books or TV shows can still be about real themes.

how do you enjoy anything fictional with this mindset??

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2019-09-27 01:15 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2019-09-27 05:27 (UTC) - Expand

People are so hellbent on shitting on people criticizing or enjoying this show, they forgot subtext and parallels exist in programming.

I think some people just don't actually like subtext

NAYRT: I think the show is dripping with subtext, but it probably has a lot more to do with families of lgbtq people than neofascists or Donald Trump. The argument that Sugar is a quisling or worse doesn't exactly parse well with the show being almost as queer as Pose.

that last line loses a lot of its sting considering that the show itself tried to pitch it as deeper than just RULE THE WORLD MUAHAHA

Yeah, I do remember that, OP, and I miss it, too. I'm tired of everything having to have a moral lesson.

Didnt the 80s have, like, Captain Planet and stuff

NAYRT—yeah, as an 80s kid I remember moral lessons in children’s media having all the subtle delicacy of a sudden rain of anvils. I would’ve loved fewer “now remember, children...” bludgeon moments.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2019-09-27 01:12 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2019-09-27 08:26 (UTC) - Expand

I just think it's a fun sweet-hearted show and I honestly don't get why people lose their minds about it. Teaching children about both good and bad emotions is a nice thing.

I would looove GI Joe thinkpieces about how the Joes are brainwashed kids into cheering for the military industrial complex and whether Cobra Commander was victim or fascist.

the Joes are brainwashed kids into cheering for the military industrial complex

I'm pretty sure people do think this and honestly it doesn't seem, like, obviously incorrect or anything

(no subject)

hey_hey_hey - 2019-09-27 02:23 (UTC) - Expand

what about when these issues are discussed in regards to other media made for 8-year-olds such as Star Wars and Harry Potter? is it hilarious then?

The intended age of both are higher than the intended age of Steven Universe

I don't think that proves anything but it's true

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2019-09-27 10:04 (UTC) - Expand

If anything, the relevant point of comparison is Invader Zim, which also used fascist aliens as villains (albeit by mocking the living hell out of them.)

Edited 2019-09-27 01:22 (UTC)

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(Anonymous) - 2019-09-28 12:28 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2019-09-29 19:42 (UTC) - Expand

Yes. I used a Steven Universe picture as an example, but the secret isn't only about SU. Or only about "shows." I should have been less specific.

probably because most of the fanbase is much older than 8. and because SU has more to offer in terms of discussion than a show like spongebob.

The thing is that Steven Universe has much better writing than your bog-standard "villain-take-over-world" Saturday morning formulaic cartoon staple. And it has writing that deliberately tackles complicated and difficult issues with some nuance. Made appropriate for kids, but still. The entire Sardonyx/Keystone Motel arc was a really thoughtful examination of betrayal and forgiveness with sympathetic but messy imperfect people. Was it a little pat in the end, because ten-minute cartoon? Yeah. But it's silly pretending that Steven Universe doesn't present itself, artistically, as a narrative that's meant to be read on multiple levels. The entire conceit of fusion as a metaphor for intimate relationships basically begs you to analyze the show beyond a surface adventure with cool combo powers.

People treat Steven Universe as deep because it is deep. Is it utterly brilliant and perfect? Of course not. Is it the only cartoon that has more complicated messages than "don't bully"? Of course not. But it deliberately and explicitly is not shallow.

Where people go wrong is thinking that all that nuance and character realism (in the sense of acting like real people instead of caricatures) extends into the realm of politics, which it doesn't, not because "it's not that deep", but because the depth is in a different spot. The villains don't just "want to take over the world" - but they're also not portrayals of serious war crimes and totalitarianism either. The diamonds are LITERALLY a family, and their totalitarian space empire is a metaphor for authoritarian and abusive family dynamics. EVERYTHING in Steven Universe is about how to navigate our connections to other people with both strength and self-respect and compassion.

So the people who want to look at it through the lens of the real implications of genocide are reading against the intentions of the show - which is fine! art is separate from intention and you can have a lot of interesting and fun thoughts reading against creator intentions! - and it can sometimes get silly, and it's not a reason to hate the show that it does something badly when it is not trying to do that thing. But people who are taking Steven Universe seriously as a show with themes and messages and serious things to say about the human condition are not, like, pulling that shit out of nowhere. There's stuff there. Just not the stuff some people are most interested in.

This explains it perfectly. The worst you can say about SU politically is that it stretches the lovingkindness a bit too far when it comes to cartoonish space tyrants.

??
I mean sure? But genocide is genocide, and imperialism is imperialism. Just because they're featured in a childrens show doesn't make them somehow less than what they are. I know nothing about this show, but if the bad guy is trying to kill off all the rock-people then that's genocide. Just like how the fire nation committed genocide towards the air nation in Avatar. Plenty of other (older) shows had these theme's when I was young as well.

They weren't, though. They were never trying to kill off the other rock people.

It was an allegory for abusive homes and how that has far-reaching effects.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2019-09-27 10:07 (UTC) - Expand

I have the strong suspicion that many people in the "always punch Nazis" camp are more interested in scolding people doing outreach and restorative justice work (which SU advocates) than actually punching Nazis.

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