fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4749 ]

[ SECRET POST #4749 ]

⌈ Secret Post #4749 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02.

[Dracula (the upcoming 2020 series)]

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03.

[Letter Bee]

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04.

[The Untamed]

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05.

[Queer Eye, S01 E03 "Dega Don't"]

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06.

[The Witcher]

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07.

[RWBY]

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08.

[The Last Airbender]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 07 secrets from Secret Submission Post #680.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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Is there any particular piece of media that would genuinely cause you to question a person's judgment if they believed it was good? Note: thinking that something is good isn't the same thing as liking something.

Nope. Media (of any type) is singularly subjective in the same way art is. I may not like Henry Moore's sculptures, but just because they don't do anything for me, doesn't mean they don't reach someone else for whatever reason.

I dunno. Birth of a Nation? Mein Kampf? Atlas Shrugged?

I'm blanking on examples right now because I'm tired, but if someone cited something that was filmed and created to be entirely exploitative/focusing on violence against women in order for male audience to get off as an example of good media, I'd very much question their judgment. Not necessarily something that just included that sort of thing because then you're talking a large portion of media. But something where it is just pervasive throughout the whole thing and/or it is clear the creator's intent wasn't to make good art, it was the "getting off on watching female bodies violated" part of it, but somehow audiences have decided it is a good movie anyway.

Actually, let's add torture porn movies in general to this mix. Don't care if any of them are supposdly "good" or "well-made." When the point of the movie is the violence and showing the audience that and getting them excited/enjoying it, it is not a good movie and I judge anyone who calls it good. There are maybe some cases and some reasons why someone might enjoy one of them (like, the same reason some people read stuff similar to what they went through for cathartic reasons), though I personally don't see how a movie (or tv, does that exist?) that violent and visceral right there on screen could have that effect).

I also sideye people who ignore the overt racism in a movie just because they think it is "good." It is one thing to say Gone With the Wind is well made, for example. But to say that because it is a classic and an artistic movie and "good" art, it doesn't matter that it is racist is another entirely.

Acknowledge it is racist, though perhaps a product of its time, and say you like it anyway or think it is a good movie in spite of that. That I don't take issue with. But pretending the racism isn't there or doesn't matter will make me question someone's judgment.

I guess something like A Serbian Film.

Yup. Like, don't know if that one is considered good in an artistic sense. Don't know if any torture porn movie is. But personally I don't think a movie where the entire point is to revel in and enjoy watching violence, torment, and gore can be considered good and I side-eye anyone who would call it good.

Edited 2020-01-07 02:23 (UTC)

I can see that, yeah.

At first I was gonna answer "no", then I saw the above anon state the obvious Mein Kampf, etc. and beyond that "no"...

But yeah. I think realistically if I hear someone is really into that kind of thing, or even gratuitous torture porn, that'd make me uncomfortable even if it were fake.

If there's not at least one thing that you'll stan for and love, in spite of everyone else in the world, you're probably not an interesting person.

Even with "problematic" media. Bannon's problem isn't that he likes xenophobic dystopian science fiction. Bannon's problem is that Bannon is an fascist asshole. And regardless, a bad taste in media doesn't make one a less competent mechanic, nurse, lawyer, or teacher.

But there is some media where if you don't recognize that it has problems and just like it in spite of that, there is a good chance you have other, real life issues going on. Movies that are overtly racist, sexist etc. or where the whole point is violence and gore. Liking them in spite of the problems is different than liking them and saying they don't have problems at all. If you Like Birth of a Nation full stop and don't see any problem with it, I think it is fairly safe to assume you might be racist in real life.

Edited 2020-01-07 02:46 (UTC)

Sure, but that usually leaks out in other ways.

And one can appreciate a work of art and disagree with its politics or philosophy. I'm not a Christian, but I can appreciate 90% of Western art. I'm not Heathen or Hellenic but I can enjoy Beowulf and sacred Greek drama. I have problems with masculinity, but I can appreciate mid-century litfic. I think Tolkien is fundamentally wrong about the theological foundations of Lord of the Rings, but it's a brilliant (and frequently misread) work of fantasy.

"Is there any particular piece of media that would genuinely cause you to question a person's judgment if they believed it was good?"

Believing something is good does not equal blind adoration. I'm puzzled why you're confused on this point.

What defines good? I'd say if someone says a movie is good with no caveats that has some core problems like racism, then I might question their judgment. If they say "this is good, but" or "good in spite of" then that's different and I wouldn't see the same issue.

Over 500 years of Western culture has some core problems like racism, including the franchise represented in your avatar photo. We can take the nihilist response of rejecting everything, or we can take the critical response of treating art like a dialogue and conversation where we're free to say, "Hey, you make good points, and express them beautifully, but you're wrong."

"This is good" is an invitation to a dialogue. I invite you to take the time to listen, talk, and argue with the work. "This is good," means that I think this work is worth your time. If we're friends, "this is good" means that I'm making a guess that this work might be to your taste. And then you can come to your own conclusions, and our disagreements will make interesting conversations.

But I honestly don't see the value in demanding caveats when everything is problematic in different ways. My caveats might not be the same as your caveats, and unless we know each other intimately well, we can't anticipate that.

Re: Inspired by 8

philstar22 - 2020-01-07 04:43 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Inspired by 8

(Anonymous) - 2020-01-07 06:42 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Inspired by 8

philstar22 - 2020-01-07 06:47 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Inspired by 8

(Anonymous) - 2020-01-07 12:45 (UTC) - Expand

Star Trek Into Darkness. One of my friends thinks it was a good movie and I haven't trusted her since.

+1

Yup.

YES

Two of my friends prefer Into Darkness over the Wrath of Khan! :O

Your friends were born on cursed land.

oh, oh god.

It's fun, not great.

Two years ago, I was extremely uncomfortable by some oscar bait arthouse film that had a suspicious age gap. Some of my former fandom friends tried to convince me that it was 'good' but I stopped being friends with them because I couldn't trust their judgement.

Bonus secret: How did I cope with this? I imagined Hayley Stark from Hard Candy befriend a boy, but when she finds out that he has an older 'friend', she gets rid of the older 'friend'.

I'm surprised you got through Hard Candy if you have a problem with age gaps.

Yuri on ice. Yeah, I know, and I specifically mean the difference between liking it and thinking it was good. There is a number of LIKEABLE things to it, but it's not a particularly good anime.

Anyone who says they love the Star Wars prequels unironically. I just know we will not get along, lol.

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