Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2008-11-30 05:02 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2008-11-30 05:02 pm
[ SECRET POST #695 ]
⌈ Secret Post #695 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
101.
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[resized]
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[row row fight da powah]
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[Stargate Atlantis]
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[Metal Gear Solid, Iron Man, House, Silence of the Lambs, Lord of the Rings, Batman, American Psycho, Dexter, Silent Hill]
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[Panic! At The Disco/Flash Flash Revolution]
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[Death Note, resized]
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130. [repeat]
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[Dr. Who]
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[they're poets from WWI]
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[Metal Gear Solid: TWINS LINKED BY CURSED GEEEEEEEEEEENES]
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[Kuroshitsuji]
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Notes:
CITY STUFF → http://lolbuttsex.myminicity.com/
Secrets Left to Post: 15 pages, 361 secrets from Secret Submission Post #100.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 - repeat ], [ 1 - doing it wrong ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
Re: 139
In addition they treated POWs horrifically.
And in the end, dropping the atom bombs was an alternative to actually invading the home islands, which would've led to massively higher casualties, both military and civilian, on both sides.
Re: 139
Re: 139
The main issue some of the commenters here seem to have about Hetalia is the fact that it seems to have no regard for human pain and makes light of the loss of life suffered during the war. And right now? It's you that seems to show this disregard and callousness.
Re: 139
The unnecessary deaths of civilians are always regrettable. You may think my attitude is callous, but the alternative to that action was a casualty count in the millions from a US invasion of the Japanese islands.
Re: 139
We are not talking about countries and their faults in the world war. We are talking about Hetalia, a comic. How is Hetalia any different from other political comics released by the west and other countries? Do they not give human characteristics to objects and/or countries from time to time? Have not some of these jokes been made before? Hetalia is a - admittedly non-PC - form of entertainment. It's supposed to be ridiculous. It's supposed to be silly. It's not meant to be taken seriously. It generalises certain characteristics which people from some countries seem to have and gives it human characteristics. Hetalia is harmless. And the mangaka has obviously not made any untoward "we of all Japan laugh at the pain of WW2 nyahahahaha!" comments through Hetalia. It concentrates instead on the relationships between the countries.
Besides, everyone seems to be concentrating on WW2. It's not the only thing that Hetalia looks at. It looks at various other historical events from ancient history to contemporary history. Sometimes, it looks at it with great sensitivity. It's a work of fiction which uses examples from history. Does that not sound familiar? Is that not what other fiction writers have done time and time again? Did Shakespeare himself not take examples of historical events and make it his own? Are we now going to condemn Shakespeare since we're condemning Hetalia for doing the same thing?
It does not make light of human suffering. It is instead trying to amuse readers. In fact, it even makes people more aware of world history. Things that a lot of people did not know before, they now know because of Hetalia. There is good and bad in every form of entertainment, of course, but to say that Hetalia is full of harm just for this one small corner of what it doesn't even concentrate on is just grossly wrong. Maybe people need to read Hetalia or at least learn more about it before they make judgemental comments that only proves how little they do know.
Re: 139
I will agree to disagree with you on the atom bombs. Not really looking to get into a huge debate on that subject, regardless.
And I agree with you on the rest of Hetalia as well. I have no issue with anthropomorphizing countries to examine relations between them. I find the idea interesting and rather cool. The only part where do take issue with it is the treatment of the Second World War, as I've mentioned. I've taken a look at it before. Not my cup of tea and I tend to find the fan-art more interesting (can't tell half of the countries apart, anyway).
Re: 139
In real life? I am a Singaporean whose family was forced into hiding during the Second World War. My father tells me stories about what happened shortly before he was born, and the persecution they faced. We don't need to get into the details, but rest assured I used to be very anti-Japanese as a child. I do bear many grudges against their actions during the war, and I am not without anger at their crimes. You cannot call me unsympathetic towards my own country, but I have Japanese friends. I have an appreciation for their culture. To me, You are acting like my five-year old bigoted self with a self-justified streak. What is wrong with you?
You are looking at it in the way that some Japanese people look at their own war crimes: "it could not be helped", "it was a cultural difference", "It didn't happen". You are clearly angry that the Japanese government has not acknowledged the inhumanity of their crimes. I am also angry, to an extent, but I would not consider the Atom bombs "Justified". How can you justify the killing of tens of thousands of uninvolved civilians as humane, and deserved just because a proposed, equally destructive operation was suggested? YOU are the one who is denying the horror of the war on the part of the Allies. Yes the Japanese needed to be stopped, and perhaps there was no other way to go about doing it except going on the offensive, but what they did was cruel and it should not stop you from feeling sympathy for human life.
Just because one side has committed atrocities does not mean the other side is immune. Depending on who wins the war, and who has the most influence, things will be glossed over in history. Many of Japan and Germany's secrets have been revealed because they lost. I do not suggest that they are RIGHT, or that these things should have been kept under wraps, because I deserve to know what happened to my family, but what has been concealed because America, UK, France, and Russia won? What don't we know about because you're all too wrapped up in your ideas of justification? The Japanese are people too, some of my best friends are Japanese. They lost their loved ones and were hurt as much as we were. Some of them still lose loved ones living in those areas to cancer. Can we deny them that sympathy just because of their government and some of their military so many years ago were irresponsible and inhumane?
To me, your assertion that "The Atom Bombs were a mercy" is the same as Japan glossing over its atrocities. I'd like to know, would the death toll really have been worse? The aftereffects of Hiroshima and Nagasaki are still felt even today. The radiation is still killing people through abnormally high instances of cancer, directly an effect of the atom bombs. Scientifically proven. If the early deaths, miscarriages and abnormalities of uninvolved civilians over sixty years through cancer do not total more than the deaths of voluntary soldiers after that hypothetical mission, I would be surprised.
I don't know where you get your ideas from, but it looks like the American textbooks have glossed things over, just as the Japanese ones have.
This has nothing to do with the fact you find hetalia distasteful. I don't care if you do. It is up to you what you read/watch. As _calex_ said, it's entertainment and if you find it crass, so be it. It's just that your, yes, callous attitude towards the Japanese people... towards the suffering of other human beings... I can't accept it.
Feel free to argue or not. It's 6am and I only have two hours to sleep now, so I won't be getting back to you any time soon.
Re: 139
And besides, doesn't the main story of Hetalia actually feature very little of the war itself, and more of the period BEFORE the war? That's what I gathered, anyway.
Re: 139
*offers breasts*And yeah, the main story of Hetalia is all just... anecdotal tidbits of silliness, war-related, UFO-related, or otherwise. I suppose the title is "Axis Powers", but honestly, WW2 is not the main focus of the webcomic. There's just as much on the past of Italy and the other nations as their is on the Axis Powers, I think.
Sometimes Fanfic/Fanart does delve into the darker aspects of the themes in Hetalia, but most of the ones I've read are tasteful and incredibly well researched, with the amount of tact and correctness that I really approve of.
Re: 139
Of course war is bad,ON ALL SIDES,but it can't be blamed on populations and APH explain it well about the different views between nation-tans and their bosses(!)
Re: 139
(Anonymous) 2008-12-01 09:55 am (UTC)(link)Re: 139
However, BOTH SIDES have to take what they have done into account. While much of the "blame" may fall on the Axis Powers, the Allies are not entirely blameless either. What I take issue most with is that this person is clearly unsympathetic to the loss of human life that occurred during Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and going so far to say that they deserved it, or that "it was better" than anything else that they could possibly have done. Yes Japan's war crimes outweigh the American's, but that does not justify the crass attitude they have against the families that lost people in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Not all Japanese are the ones who are raping and hurting people, and many of the victims of the A-bombs were civilians. Sure some of them supported the war, but I'm sure there were some that just wanted to live in peace, and these are the people that deserve sympathy and regret.
Re: 139
I realize I sound very pro-Japanese at the moment, but it is only in regards to such a comment as "I have no sympathy at all for them." I have no sympathy in regards to Yasukuni Shrine, I am not sympathetic for the persecution my family and my people have faced, nor the use of my home country as a POW camp, but I do feel sympathetic for the civilians and families that are continually affected by the horrors of the atomic bombs.
We cannot live in the past, we have to move on. I do not believe in persecuting the future generations for what was done in the past by other people. I cannot vouch for the Government, but uninvolved families were dragged into it as well on a massive scale, and I feel so so horrible that people would feel no sympathy at all for them, just because they were Japanese, and because their soldiers and their government have done awful things.