[ SECRET POST #5221 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #5221 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


01.



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02.
[Classic Who]


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03.
[Joy of Life]


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04.
[Avenue X]


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05.
[Code Vein]


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06.
[Jodie Turner-Smith as Anne Boleyn]


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07.
[Fate Grand Order/ The Fate series; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGwvNG_DWE0 (contains spoilers)]


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08. https://i.imgur.com/JBB5Ehr.png
[OP warned for slightly NSFW image]










Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 08 secrets from Secret Submission Post #747.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I think there's a difference between colorblind casting for a role like (for example) Ophelia in Hamlet and colorblind casting to play an actual person. The reason why I'm skeptical about this being for woke points is because the showrunners must know it's going to create huge publicity by casting a black woman to play Anne Boleyn and I feel cynical about their motive.

[(Anonymous)]

I think that's pretty blurry given how much Shakespeare was derivative of "history" (via fictionalized sources). Hamlet is largely fictional (although there may have been a Rosencrantz and Gildenstern). Julius and Richard, less so.

[(Anonymous)]

I disagree, and don't find it particularly blurry at all. "Inspired by" history is not the same as actual history. If the topic of discussion were, say, Shakespeare's Richard III, then I'd agree with you - he took a lot of poetic license there in his portrayal. But this is Hamlet and it is much, much further removed from history. So removed that I don't think anyone else is confused that it is fictional, and that while a real person may have, at some point, inspired the character of Juliet, Juliet is not a real person.

[(Anonymous)]

SA - Sorry, I typed "Juliet" when I meant "Ophelia".

[(Anonymous)]

OK but then couldn't you just say that this project is "inspired by history" and not actual history in the same way that Julius Caesar or Richard III are?

I know I've seen an all-black production of Julius Caesar.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't understand. It wouldn't matter what *I* said about this project, because I'm not the creator or showrunner. The production in question isn't being marketed as "inspired by history", it's being marketed as a drama detailing the final months in Anne Boleyn's life, exploring her downfall as Queen of England. That's a real person, and real historical events.

[(Anonymous)]

But it's a fictional interpretation of those events.

[(Anonymous)]

You're right and you should say it, anon. The AYRT is being willfully obtuse.

[(Anonymous)]

Lmao I may be obtuse but it's certainly not willful

[(Anonymous)]

If it's being marketed as a drama then we're firmly in the "inspired by" category.

Granted, audiences are often thick as a brick when it comes to credulously assuming that historical dramas reflect real events. So if casting introduces even a little bit of skepticism in the audience, that's a win in my book.

[(Anonymous)]

I have to admit that a fair chunk of my bad vibe comes from having just wrapped a so-called "documentary" where the dramatized segments were blatantly sensationalized. And it was really egregious WRT a character who is barely documented by primary sources doing bad feminist monologues barely dressed for the camera.

The ideas of so-called "historical dramas" or "biopics" are oxymorons. Real history and real biography are notoriously unfriendly to cinema. And I kind of wish the people making them would go full Shakespeare and just do everything in modern garb on a minimal set to make that point, at least for a generation or so.

[(Anonymous)]

Did they make it clear that it was an "inspired by" rather than a "historical documentary" kind of movie? "The Favorite" made that clear about itself in its promotion, and that's why it's great. If they'd marketed that one as just straight up "retelling of the life of a famous queen" it would have been WAY different in how it was perceived. "Inspired by" movies can do a lot of things that would hit way different if they were promoted as being a straight up retelling.

[(Anonymous)]

From the announcement last year:

Deadline can reveal that the ViacomCBS-owned broadcaster has commissioned a three-part series that will examine the downfall of Boleyn through the prism of a psychological thriller rather than a stuffy period drama retreading the demise of King Henry VIII’s second wife. (emphasis added)

https://deadline.com/2020/10/jodie-turner-smith-plays-anne-boleyn-channel-5-series-from-fable-pictures-1234605855/

None of that says "historical documentary" to me.

[(Anonymous)]

SA: Further in the article:

> Penned by newcomer Eve Hedderwick Turner, the drama *shines a feminist light* on the final months of Boleyn’s life, *re-imagining* her struggle with Tudor England’s patriarchal society, her desire to secure a future for her daughter, Elizabeth, and the brutal reality of her failure to provide Henry with a male heir.

So, it's a Tragedy of Anne Boleyn using the historic outline of a 16th century figure to create a psychological thriller around 21st-century themes, in the same way that Shakespeare wrote The Tragedy of Macbeth using the historic outline of an 11th century figure to create a psychological thriller around 17th century themes.

Not a historic reenactment, which would also be tacitly revisionist while pretending not to be.

[(Anonymous)]

I think that almost all treatments of Anne Boleyn fall into the "inspired by" category.

[(Anonymous)]

In the BBC's Hollow Crown series version of Henry VI, Sophie Okonedo played Queen Margaret, who was a real person. Because she was a French person and not English, it makes sense for the actor playing her to be black and not white - to demonstrate her foreignness, though I didn't think she was that great in the role. I'm looking forward to seeing what they do with Anne Boleyn and don't really care about historical accuracy.

[(Anonymous)]

if you are using race in casting to draw some point about the story, like in the example you use here where you have a black actress to draw the line that the character is from a different culture - that's not actually colour blind casting, is it?

(I'm not disagreeing with you, to be clear, I just think it's an important point if people want to talk about colourblind casting)

[(Anonymous)]

mte, that seems like it's just further reinforcing the OP's point. Casting a non-white actor or actress to emphasize a character's "foreignness" is pretty much the exact opposite of color blind casting.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, I don't think it reinforces OP's point, either.

It's just talking about something other than colourblind casting.