fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #782 ]

[ SECRET POST #782 ]

⌈ Secret Post #782 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 07 pages, 165 secrets from Secret Submission Post #112.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

The irony of you saying that with a Xena (I think?) icon is staggering.

Lol, not all Xena fans are feminists. I LOVE Xena, but I'm certainly not into feminism (nor do I really hate it, I just tune it out).

Do you believe that women should have the right to vote, and should get equal pay for doing equal work? If you said yes to either part of that question, then you are a feminist. And that is just to name a few of the broadest examples.

That's like the people who support the idea of women as people means they're feminists.

You just stretched the definition of the term to meaninglessness, quite frankly. :p Feeling they deserve equal rights as anyone else doesn't mean one is a feminist, unless you're absolutely dying to slap a label on everyone.

holy god you're dumb

Care to get into why, or is it because you don't agree with what I'm saying? xD Because different point of view =/= dumb.

Actually, that IS the definition of feminism. Viewing women as equals and thinking they deserve equal rights...thinking they are ACTUAL PEOPLE. You would be surprised how many people don't think that's the case.

That's not the definition I use, and it's not the definition a lot of people I know use, whether it's technically, TECHNICALLY right if you were looking it up in a dictionary. But people really do define the word differently.

If that's your definition or the poster above me, that's fine! I'm not going to tell anyone to change it. It's just when applied to me personally, with something that does have a few ways of looking at it, I'm not open to having their definition FORCED on me, if you know what I mean. I definitely do not think of myself as a feminist just because I think we have the right to vote.

That's like the people who support the idea of women as people means they're feminists.

DING DING DING! Give the girl a prize!

Feminism is supporting equality for women. It's acknowledging they deserve the same rights anyone else has. If you believe that you are a feminist.

Godamn, the stupidity is staggering.

Godamn, the stupidity is staggering.

You're talking about yourself, right?

IT'S OPINION. I don't see myself as a feminist just because I believe women are people. I never will. This is a broad definition. See a post I made below because I'm not going to bother rewriting it.

Edit: Whoops. Post actually right above yours, in the line of comments.

Edited 2009-02-26 03:50 (UTC)

The bitchiness is what's staggering. I think in her first post she meant to refer to extreme feminism, which definitely does not stop at simply believing women are people with equal rights.

Then she should have said 'extreme feminism.' There's a difference.

Well she didn't. Whoops. Big deal. I'm going to pack away me ePenis now.

Actually, that is in fact what "feminist" means.

[agrees]

Everyone is all about labels and telling people what they are, what they aren't, and what they should be.

I think the biggest problem here is that people often just use "feminism" to refer also to "radical feminism" and "extreme feminist" which are the branches I have problems with, which is why I'm not always so comfortable using the term applied to myself.

Edited 2009-02-26 06:39 (UTC)

Broad being the key word.

Your questions lump everyone on the planet into either being a feminist or a bigot. While some feminists claim feminism is the idea that women are people, it's a bit too broad to have much meaning in any kind of a discussion.

Dude, Xena is feminist. Smart, strong, confident, doesn't need a man in her life to be fulfilled, all the things feminists want to work towards. If you don't care for feminists, why would you like her?

Umm...so many things wrong with that comment! Key reason for liking her?

Because Xena is cool!

And also, I like to think her character is deeper than "lol feminism". If that's all people think Xena is or thing that's the biggest part of her character, they need to take another look!

Xena isn't a feminist. Or for some fans, JUST a feminist. She doesn't say "fuck men", you wouldn't find her in a march for women's rights. She does what she does to help people, male or female. She's a hero.

Also, as far as not needing a man in her life to be fulfilled no, she doesn't - but she still fell in love with a few men, which I think a lot of people forget. I know falling in love with men doesn't mean you can't be a feminist, but people arguing that point tend to conveniently forget the men in her life anyway.

Edited 2009-02-26 03:36 (UTC)

Xena is cool BECAUSE she's feminist. She's like Wonder Woman that way, although with a bit less of the whole bondage thing. The kind of sword-swinging ass-kicking she does? Pre-feminism you'd be very hard pressed to see that presented as a positive, reasonable thing for a woman to be doing.

Nothing wrong with men in your life, the problem crops up when you can't live as an independent person without one. Xena can.

Xena is cool BECAUSE she's feminist.

Couldn't disagree more xD There is so much more to her than that. But anyway, this is like talking to a wall so I'm done.

Xena is way cool.

And the fact she doesn't go around beating her chest about feminism? Makes her more of one, IMO. Seriously, I have a job where I have to compete with men. I don't get up every morning going "oh, how am I going to outfox those sly menfolk today?" I just do my job.

And you're right, even if Xena is a feminist - that's not what defines her character. She's a hero, which transcends gender IMO. Why should she or Wonder Woman be looked at on gender any more than Batman or Spidey? I like them all for different reasons.

She's a hero, which transcends gender IMO.

Right on! I mean heck - she was reincarnated as a man, so sometimes when watching I get to a point of "does gender even matter? Nah, go Xena!" XD

"does gender even matter?"

DINGDINGDINGDINGDING!!!

I mean, I sort of get why gender matters, to the OP and others. But on the other hand ... you don't get people to agree with your POV by insulting them or making the non-offenders feel like they've done something wrong by lumping them in with the extremists of a category. Most slashers I know don't hate or even dislike the female characters in their fandoms - they just want to move her off to the side (usually unharmed - or hell, even in her own storyline) so they can have fun with their m/m OTP. I don't like the ones who are all frothy mouth-hate on female characters, either, but they certainly don't make up most slash fans. (For what it's worth, I have a favorite character in my fandom that I've had to learn to accept a lot of other fans just don't like. I've had to learn to tape my mouth shut and accept that it's their preference. It cuts down on the number of fans I can discuss and have fun with, but ... you know, I can't force them.)

Yea. I mean, I do get what the OP was saying, when I made my own reply to this entry of F!S I didn't really address it though as I had nothing to really say except "I kinda sorta agree but not lalalalalala"...I only got into this via responding to someone else's comment xp

I actually used to know a lot of slashers who were really forceful about their pairings and killed/insulted females, so I got that part of it. It's really pretty dependent on who you meet throughout your fandoms I guess. So I understand that kind of anger. But I know all slashers aren't like that, the people I keep company with now are pretty nice to the "girl in the way" in our fandom pairing xD Usually nice things happen for her.

I've had to learn to tape my mouth shut and accept that it's their preference.

Ugh sucks you have to do that though.

Ugh sucks you have to do that though.

I accept it's partly my fault. Had I shut up sooner, the dislike probably would've died down sooner. In my defense, I can only say that I saw it tied to a rather wanky POV in support of a particular 'ship, and it always annoyed me that certain people couldn't get off on their own 'ship without ripping apart a third character standing in its way, usually with no real point and purpose to plot. (Sort of like the OP and her "why are you picking on the woman just because she's there?") For the record, my character is male, which means I couldn't even counter the rampant dislike with "you're being misogynistic!" as a defense. (Which I don't think of as an automatic defense for dislike of a female character. Some female characters just rub people the wrong way because of their characterization, not their gender.)

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #782 ]

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