[ SECRET POST #5396 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #5396 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 31 secrets from Secret Submission Post #772.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

The bathroom issue is dumb but there are a lot more people that object to sharing intimate quarters (women's shelters for one) with penis people than you're willing to admit. Get out of here with that 'you need to get over your discomfort and trauma surrounding penises so you won't hurt other's fee fees' bullshit.

[(Anonymous)]

hurt other's fee fees??? you stupid fuck, how can you advocate for women's safety and then go "oh except for those women, because they may or may not have a penis and that's uncomfortable :("
you think trans women don't get abused? you think trans women don't get raped? they don't get stalked? killed? you think people with vaginas don't abuse women???

for some reason you realise that forcing a women to be sheltering with men when she has "discomfort and trauma" surrounding them would be cruel, but then you go out and say well trans women just have to suck it up because i'm imagining their dicks and that is somehow their fault.

fuck offfffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

[(Anonymous)]

Build shelters that are specifically trans inclusive. Acknowledging trans women are different is a no no, so that will never happen.

Here's a suggestion: Just like you tell cis women to go to therapy to get over their penis problems, tell penis people to go to therapy so they can realize there are cis women who will NEVER want to share close quarters with penises. Thanks.

[(Anonymous)]

see this is just full mask off because everyone who's even slightly concerned about trans women is aware that there are plenty trans women who do not have penises, but you don't give a shit that's not what this is about, you just want to hate trans people and look good doing it

not today you reprobate

[(Anonymous)]

One of your favorite lines is NOT ALL TRANS WOMEN HAVE PENISES, so yes, I'm very aware that some trans women don't have penises.

[(Anonymous)]

NAYRT--the worst violations I've ever dealt with were at the literal hands of another cis woman and yet somehow I just have to deal with cis women having hands and I myself am a cis woman with hands. If I objected to working and existing around cis women's hands I would be rightfully told to a) get therapy and b) learn to live with it.

[(Anonymous)]

It sucks what happened to you, and yes, you should say you're uncomfortable around women, but I'm going to hazard a guess and say more cis women have been hurt, abused, sexually assaulted and murdered by people born with dicks than AFAB XX people.

[(Anonymous)]

wooooooooooooooooooooooooooow

[(Anonymous)]

Fuck off and eat shit, transphobe, I hope you die alone and miserable like the refuse on the bottom of my shoe you are <3

[(Anonymous)]

I have literally never seen any of my roommates' genitals, so where are you getting the idea that people in shelters are going to know if any of the women they're sharing with have penises..... unless they inquire, which is invasive and should not be done ever just to satisfy the worry that they miiight?

[(Anonymous)]

Agreed. Women shouldn't be placed with fuckers like this https://www.womenarehuman.com/male-transgender-boasts-of-harassing-women-in-crisis-shelter/

[(Anonymous)]

The problem is, trauma isn't logical. It's trauma.

If a cis woman is in a shelter because she's been raped and abused by a man, and has serious trauma about being in close quarters with somebody with XY anatomy, the fact that trans women are women isn't going to make that any better or less traumatising for her.

It doesn't matter how much you cry 'transphobia' and get all lower-case angry about it, it's not that woman's fault that she's terrified to be in a room with somebody with XY anatomy. It's just how it is. And while transwomen are women, they have the XY anatomy. It goes beyond genitals. Late transitions have the wide shoulders and general outline of cis men. That can be triggering to somebody who has experienced trauma at the hands of men.

That isn't to say that transwomen don't belong in womens shelters, but there's a lot more nuance than you are putting into this. You're a shitty person, elevating one woman's trauma over another. Both can coexist without being shut up in a room together at the expense of one's comfort. Stop being a dickbag and pitting the different trauma of women and transwomen against each other.

It's great that you advocate for transwomen. What fuels the fire of the terf dipshits is that you're advocating for them at the expense of cis women with real, deep-seated trauma. Women and transwomen are not the same. They have different fights. There's a lot of intersection, of course there is, but to act like there's no difference between the two is absurd.

(The stupid bathroom debate does not enter into this, since a cis man can easily walk into a woman's bathroom at any time and do what they want -- there's no cameras, there's no penis alarms, it's a strawman argument. Shelters, however, are different.)

You do not put somebody with trauma in a room with the thing that causes that trauma. You don't put an arachnophobe in a room with a spider. You don't lock somebody terrified of dogs in a room with a dog. You don't put a transwoman in a room with a bunch of men if she's bean beaten up by men. You don't put a woman who is scared of being raped by a cis man in a room with somebody with XY anatomy, no matter how she identifies.

It's not fair on either of them and no self-respecting transwoman, either pre- or post gender confirmation surgery, would demand to be put in a room with a traumatised rape victim to prove a point and if she does then she, like you, is a fucking dick. No transperson I know (and I know a lot, since they're my community) would advocate for putting their comfort over another victim's when there was literal trauma on the table.

There should be different comfort levels at women's shelters. Some cis women are more or less happy to be with a transwoman. Some, the ones mentioned in the rest of this post, are not, and that's understandable. It's not deliberate discrimination, it's trauma. You don't get to tell a traumatised person that they're being stupid or cruel. You don't get the blame a victim for their traumatized reactions to triggers out of their control. If people could control their reactions to triggers, they wouldn't be fucking triggers.

Get bent.

[(Anonymous)]

imagine having your head so far up your own ass you think anyone's going to read that word vomit couldn't be me

[(Anonymous)]

You do not put somebody with trauma in a room with the thing that causes that trauma. You don't put an arachnophobe in a room with a spider. You don't lock somebody terrified of dogs in a room with a dog. You don't put a transwoman in a room with a bunch of men if she's bean beaten up by men. You don't put a woman who is scared of being raped by a cis man in a room with somebody with XY anatomy, no matter how she identifies.

I don't disagree, but it seems to me that this is a problem that you should be able to address on a case-by-case basis, not a problem that you have to structure everything around. So it's not clear to me how this really justifies the solution that TERFs are advocating.

If you want to talk about the importance of nuance, I don't think that TERFs are approaching this situation with nuance at all. I don't think it helps anyone to take the approach that they do, and fulminate about how dangerous and evil trans women are. I think they're pretty clearly using the issue as a cudgel against trans people. And I think that's probably mostly why people respond the way they do.

[(Anonymous)]

And women's shelters are, ideally, equipped to help women with that level of trauma and not put them into any situations that make them, as individuals, feel unsafe. That's an individual care issue.

It's generalizing and saying that any trans woman is absolutely going to trigger any given trauma that's bullshit. If you want to approach this conversation with nuance, then approach it with nuance.

[(Anonymous)]

You do not put somebody with trauma in a room with the thing that causes that trauma.

Cool. Start segregating by race, then, because a lot of black women like me have suffered trauma at the hands of you white bitches. Wait? You won't? Trans-fucking-parent transphobia.

But then, this same logic allows the "gay panic" defense, so why am I surprised. "It's not DISCRIMINATION, it's TRAUMA!"

[(Anonymous)]

My triggers include the noise of my back gate opening, green gloves, the phrase "the devil made me do it," women who resemble the (white cis) one who assaulted me, alternative medicine and/or diet as medicine and healthy/clean eating, hugs...

Obviously shelter staff should help people manage their triggers and not deliberately expose them, but singling out penises is dumb as hell. Especially because no one at a shelter should be waving one attached to their body around or playing hot potato with a realistic dildo or...

Look, if someone is waving their dick around in public at a shelter for cis men that's still a problem, for the same reason a woman walking around a woman's shelter with her pussy hanging out is a problem.

Genitals + public or shared with non romantic or sexual partner spaces = bad. Indecent exposure= bad. Sexual assault, with dick or hands or idk, rubber chickens = bad.

Being exposed to triggers sucks but acting like penises are somehow so much worse, trigger-wise, than any other possible trigger is bullshit. Especially because if you're looking at a penis in a shelter environment, either you (because you're staring at someone who didn't want to be stared at in a private moment) or the penis-haver (because they want to force people to look at it) is being enough of a creep that they should be thrown out.

[(Anonymous)]

Watch people tell you you are wrong for not seeing things in black and white, good and evil, TWAW!!!! and TERF. No nuance, just knee-jerk reactions from jerks.

[(Anonymous)]

Do you think they're MAGICALLY going to feel safer if a big burly obviously masculine trans man with a bikers beard and tattoos is put in the women's shelter because placement was been determined by chromosomes or the content of his pants?

The people who're triggered by a trans woman's presence in a shelter are going to be just as triggered by a cis women who have features they associate with trans people (this already targets butch cis women, cis women of colour and cis women with any not conventionally feminine features) long before a single look at anyone's genitals occurs.

Once you get to examining genitals, something has gone very wrong and people have already been made extremely unsafe by people looking for the opportunity to check genitals.

[(Anonymous)]

My question with this is always - people can have trauma over a bunch of different things, right? Penises aren't the only thing that people can have trauma about. And having trauma sucks. It's shitty and we should absolutely do what we can to help people who have that trauma in whatever way they need help. It's not something we can just ask people to get over, we should provide whatever support we can and whatever accommodations are reasonably possible for whatever kind of trauma you want to talk about. But it seems to me like you can't actually plan your social support systems around every form of trauma that someone might hypothetically have. And it feels like the primary reason for emphasizing this one form of trauma as against any other form of trauma is, frankly, prejudice. So it just doesn't seem like a good justification.

IDK. That's just how I see it.

[(Anonymous)]

This.

[(Anonymous)]

By your logic, all shelters should be separated by race because what if a white woman has trauma related to black people

[(Anonymous)]

Cis/AFAB/XX Black women and cis/AFAB/XX white women are both cis women. People born with penises of all races and genders are still people born with penises. Also cis women in shelters are there, more often than not, because they were abused by cis male partners or family members. Nice try.

Why do you people always try to bring cis Black women into this?

[(Anonymous)]

NAYRT

Are you serious?

[(Anonymous)]

Black women are still black. White women cared of black women should be able to escape them because of their trauma with black people. Or hell, what if it's a black woman afraid of white women? Separate them, right? What? You don't advocate that? Gee, you're telling on yourself.

Also, before your lily white ass complains, I am black and I see your hypocrisy a million miles away.