fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #5396 ]

[ SECRET POST #5396 ]

⌈ Secret Post #5396 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 31 secrets from Secret Submission Post #772.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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It's also a bit oof to suggest that a nonbinary Westerner who finds themselves relating to a cis male from a Chinese canon and projects onto that character for comfort is being racist. Cultural differences are always going to influence what people personally get from things.

I know not all people with these headcanons have them for that reason, but you can't assume that they're all just cis people accidentally being racist for nb ally points.

In other words I feel this is a disingenuous argument and "that's racist" in fandom almost always has some underlying concern-trollish agenda that's not really concern for racism at all. Like the "racebending Asian characters as black is racist because you think Asians aren't POC enough" is usually just a cover for "I don't want to see this beautiful character I love reimagined as *shudder* black"

And then there are some of us who think that it DOES feel like people are saying Chinese people aren't POC enough. Because that... is kind of what people are doing.

it literally is racist though. an asian character is a poc, full stop. you don't need to "racebend" them to make them a poc because they already are.

the only thing racist about it is when people assume that just because the character is Black that they're not also Chinese.

This is such a stupid argument. That's like saying "lol just because the character is African doesn't mean they can't be white" as an excuse to racebend African characters into being white just because South Africa has a certain number of white people as well.

No? It's not? Mixed race people exist you weirdo

That's never something that gets included in those headcanons though. And even if it were- still doesn't make things less racist.

It get included all the time, what are you talking about? Can you explain why you think it’s racist, since you just keep saying it’s racist without giving a reason?

I agree with you. Obviously people are going to deny this, but they often hide prejudice under pseudo-social justice arguments, when what they're actually arguing for is keeping up the status quo, where there's no characters with "undesirable" social status in the media. And no, a Japanese character in Japanese media isn't a minority, no matter how you try to spin it. It may be incorrect to use the term "POC" when you mean "disenfranchised minority", but people who pretend to not understand that this is what you mean when you complain about the lack of diversity in anime are being wilfully obtuse.

Black characters in a nlack franchise are also not a minority and yet it would be racist to racebend them, even into a different type of POC. And you'd be the first to call it out. Dont be obtuse, your double standards are showing.
And don't say POC when you mean "exclusively black".

double standards AND western ignorance. japan has its own disenfranchised minorities, they just aren't black. if this was really about wanting representation for "disenfranchised minorities," then why not make the characters ainu or zainichi korean?

Or hell, even white. Because I know a whole lot of white people who face actual institutionalised racism in Japan by being ignored when searching for apartments etc.

Ah yes, the infamous "there are no black people in Poland so there shouldn't be any in The Witcher" argument, Japan Edition. If you think there are no dark-skinned POC immigrants in Japan or that white immigrants are treated in the exact same way as dark-skinned immigrants, you are the one who is ignorant.

There are dark skinned POC immigrants in Japan but you are apparently unable to understand that dark-skinned does not automatically mean black.

Speaking as a person from a country where over 99% of people are white, I'm fully aware that not all POCs are black, but I'm also fully aware that any visibly dark-skinned person here will be treated very very, very much worse than any white person, even one of those white ethnicities, which are often discriminated against here. Anyone claiming otherwise is a liar.

i've lived in japan. the overall number of immigrants there is tiny and the majority of them are either korean or chinese.

I'm aware of this. Yet, even despite the tiny number of white immigrants, no one argues that Japan shouldn't create white characters. And before you start arguing that all anime characters are supposed to be Japanese, let me remind you that they had to replace the character of Levi in the live-action Attack on Titan, because his name was too foreign. I doubt that Edward Elric was intended to be Japanese either. L from Death Note was explicitly stated by the author to be of mixed ethnicity, near and Mello are white. Even Masashi Kishimoto said in an interview once that if characters in Naruto were any real-life ethnicities, Sasuke would be Japanese, Sakura would be European, and Naruto would be an American. So clearly, the low number of white immigrants in Japan doesn't stop Japanese artists from creating white character in their franchise.

you're moving the goalposts. yes, japan creates white characters, but it's uncommon to have white characters in anime that are set in japan, and when you do see them they're usually treated as a novelty/something strange and foreign.

if the argument behind the racebending is "i want to racebend this character from an ethnic majority into a disenfranchised minority," then in japan that would be ainu, zainichi korean or anyone half-japanese because japan is not the us and does not have the same racial politics as the us. anyone foreign in japan faces a certain amount of discrimination regardless of their ethnicity simply because they aren't japanese. the actual systemic discrimination with a history is against people like the ainu and the zainichi koreans, not black people (or white people) because they're effectively a non-entity in japan.

You're the one moving the goalposts. How else to call it when you're suddenly moving the topic from black characters in anime, to black characters in anime specifically set in Japan. I'm simply pointing out that it's worth to examine why do so many creatives around the world feel inspired to design, create and develop white characters, but never black characters, or other dark-skinned POCs.

I have no doubt that Japanese discriminate against anyone who isn't a full-blooded Japanese and I'm all for creating more Ainu characters, and Korean characters in Japanese media. But it's not an either-or. Creating or "race-bending" a character to be black doesn't take away all available slots for the permitted number of minority characters in the media, and demanding that black anime fans must first accommodate all oppressed people in Japan before they're allowed to accommodate themselves has the same energy as people, who insist that feminists need to first solve the problems of all oppressed groups in the world before they're allowed to focus on women's rights. Black anime fans are going to want to see themselves represented in their favourite media, which already has plenty of representation of white people, there's absolutely nothing morally wrong about that so stop treating it as if it was.

Re: SA

(Anonymous) - 2021-10-15 14:01 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2021-10-15 19:54 (UTC) - Expand

Re: SA

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Re: SA

(Anonymous) - 2021-10-16 00:08 (UTC) - Expand

Masashi Kishimoto is a fucking idiot if that's really what he said; European and American aren't ethnicities. You can be European or American and also ethnically Japanese.

DA

That was a really dumb thing for him to say, for real.

"Black franchise" meaning what? Nigerian cinema? If so, then sure, I'd agree with you. American cinema? Don't make me laugh.

And don't say POC when you mean "exclusively black".

never have I said anything of the sort. In fact, I don't think I've ever seen a single mainstream work of fiction where literally all characters would be black. Some niche fantasy works in a corner of the bookstore, or a webcomic with a cast of 3-5 characters maybe, but nothing that would compare to big budget Hollywood productions (even Black Panther had major white characters), or games (such as the Witcher, which has no POC characters at all, or World of Warcraft, which didn't even have a dark-skinned character texture up until last year, when they celebrated 25 years of being #1 most popular MMORPG), or top rated book translated to every language around the world such as Harry Potter, or animes or... anything else, really.

You know you can be both nonbinary and still culturally insensitive/racist, right? Plenty of them are. That's not something reserved for cis people.

Right? That argument is so weird.

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[ SECRET POST #5396 ]

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