fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #815 ]

⌈ Secret Post #815 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

101.

[Weird Al Yankovic and Stephen Colbert]

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102. [repeat]

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103.

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104.

[Yu-Gi-Oh]

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105.

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106.

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107. [repeat]

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108.

[Rachael Maddow]

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109.

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110.

[The Office]

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111.

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113.

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114.

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116.

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117.

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[Phantom of the Opera]

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[previously linked wrong]

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127.

[hunter s. thompson]

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131. [repeat]

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132.

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134.

[Hotel Babylon]

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135.

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137. [repeat]

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138.

[jake hurwitz]

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148.

[but why not the men?]

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[Naruto]

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[Naruto]

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158.

[Jade Goody]

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[previously linked wrong]

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167.

[High School Musical]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 11 pages, 275 secrets from Secret Submission Post #116.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 4 - repeat ], [ 1 2 - doing it wrong ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

How are they bashing the character if what they say is true?

It is bashing the main character because OP is saying that "a man who does X, Y and Z" is EVIIIIIIIIL! And also that their POV and interpretation is OMGTHEONLYTRUEONE and everyone else is wrong, and is furthermore not permitted to write whatever they please. No one denies that Erik is creepy, it's kind of the point. But it's still bashing the character to go on and on about how many types of creepy it is and how anyone who doesn't realise it has issues, and then say snidely "You know, the more romantic quote? That wasn't Phantom."

It is in all cases bashing. If they said "I love this character but I admit X, Y and Z about him", that is not bashing. But no, they said "Character did X, Y, and Z, and is EVIL!", and that is bashing.

But hey, OP would be a wrong little bitch either way you go about it.

Right.

Secret doesn't say he is evil (though I don't think the secret maker would necessarily be wrong by most people's standards, considering he is a serial killer, if they did say that. Many people also consider abusive men to be pretty evil as well). Secret says his behavior is very wrong and abusive. Secret maker is correct. Therefore they are not bashing his character.

Bashing his character would be to say 'HE KILLS AND RAPES EVERYTHING THAT MOVES!!' or 'HE IS SUCH A SLUT' because that is false. What the secret maker said is not false, as it is firmly backed by canon (they even kindly provided quotes).

I'm not touching whether they are ship/shipper bashing because I'm in the fandom. Just the character bashing bit.

The person is bashing those who even like Erik more than Raoul. Perhaps it was just the way it was phrased, but "Sick and tired of phanbrats painting him as some martyr who lost to that evil abusive pretty-boy fop Raoul" definitely begs a response from some of those "phanbrats," which I take a rather hefty amount of offense at. I don't even ship Christine/Erik, but I do ship Erik with far more interesting characters than Christine, (also I think the Erik/Christine ship brings out each of their issues, rather than working through them). However, apart from that, I would rather ship Erik/Christine than Raoul/Christine, which is boring. There's no plot except the two of them being sickeningly cutesy. Of course, I might have spent too long reading Iago-as-a-little-black-dress fic, so my "abusive and manipulative" standards when reading fic might be down.

That being said, I would much rather write and read fic dealing with Erik than dealing with Christine and Raoul. And, doing that well involves making Erik a martyr of sorts (actually, making Erik a martyr is kind of canon; the book makes him a martyr, particularly with that wonderful end scene where Erik is crying "she kissed me!" over and over again after he let Christine go away with Raoul). So, yes, I do make Erik a martyr of sorts, a martyr of his own past. Erik did have issues, including the complete insanity by the end of the book, however to say he might have had reasons for those issues is some of the complexity that is left out of the OP's secret.

different anon

"Sick and tired of phanbrats painting him as some martyr who lost to that evil abusive pretty-boy fop Raoul"

hit a nerve, did they? sounds like you're butthurt that your likes were called out in a secret. just admit that you care about what one anon on the ENTIRE INTERNET might think about you and just move on.

I said in my comment, I'm only referring to character bashing, not ship/shipper or indeed character fans. Martyr? It does not mean what you think it means. Deciding to not force Christine/unnecessrily kill people etc. a martyr does not usually make. Frankly, what you describe still falls under the creepy, obsessed and fucked up in the head category.

I don't care what people ship (I'm not even in this fandom). I ship canon/non-canon ships. I ship 'boring' and 'interesting' ships, I ship healthy and and non-healthy ships. But I do get pissed when people completely gloss over all the issues, because then it's no longer the ship I ship, but is just something else with their names tagged on. Why ship something so dysfunctional and interesting to you and then take away everything that made it interesting and dysfunctional?

I'm a Snape fan who has to sift through countless woobie fanfics/essays/fanworks and so forth stripping him of everything that made him interesting, I come across too many comments who blame Lily for how he turned out because she didn't fall into his arms (and James for 'stealing' her from Snape), so I can understand where the OP is coming from in their frustration about Erik's characterization and the ship itself.

Just to chime in, Erik would've ended up in jail or a mental asylum if he was arrested. Or executed, considering the time period. While he may not be "evil", he certainly wasn't a good man by any stretch of the imagination.

Agree with you on your other points, though.

[ SECRET POST #815 ]

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