[ SECRET POST #5713 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #5713 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 05 pages, 115 secrets from Secret Submission Post #818 .
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[meadowphoenix]

.....hmmm.

I think there's a very real distinction that is being made between "true crime" as a term which is meant to attract people to it, which is about physical danger to other people as a baseline, and the scammer genre (which is probably a subgenre of crime yes, but which occupies a completely different space of crime enthusiasts than "true crime"), which is about psychological manipulation of people and/or coveting of things as the principal motivation. It might escalate to physical harm, but that tells you how wild the crime has gotten, that's not the baseline expectation of the crime. Of course there is overlap and with con artists sometimes a lot of overlap, but these are not marketed the same way at ALL. Scams are treated significantly more lightly than "true crime," to the point where people don't feel it at all tacky to make fun of victims of such crimes (see: fyre festival).

The "true crime" cons that have been extent for years are about murder, for instance, not art heists or scammers. The "fandom" such as it is, has been about murder and murderers, again, for years. The people into crime stories who are interested in scams as much as or more than murders is relatively new.

[(Anonymous)]

"The people into crime stories who are interested in scams as much as or more than murders is relatively new."

I'm not sure this is true? The true crime fans who are into murders are the loudest, most prominent part of fandom. I'd even agree that they're probably the majority. But I don't think there's much evidence that true crime fans who are interested in non-murder stories are some new-fangled thing. "Who stole the [insert valuable/famous/huge thing here]" generates interest because it's a mystery and people love mysteries.

[meadowphoenix]

I mean as a fandom. But sure, anecdata isn't data. What non-physical crimes have ye olde fandoms that are comparable to Jack the Ripper and the like? What are the scams that still have people gathering together to talk about them in clubs?

[(Anonymous)]

Jack the Ripper is kind of a sui generis case, and the key factor isn't murder or even multiple murders (because there are plenty of cases equally gruesome that aren't nearly as famous), it's the fact that the investigation was so disorganized as it was the early days of detection, there are multiple suspects (and even those are a just a guess!), but it's unsolved and likely to never ever be solved to the debate can go on for ages.

Keep in mind that the fandom for historical/ancient mysteries has a very large overlap in true crime, and it's got a huge following. I'm talking stuff like Bigfoot, Loch Ness Monster, location of Atlantis, the Rosetta Stone, who built Stonehenge, etc.

But this kind of strays from my point. I never argued that non-murder true crime was more popular, or more widely discussed than murder-related crime. I just said that it's absurd to assume that the entire genre is about murder. There are absolutely grounds for people to make sweeping generalizations, because the grisly crimes get the lion's share of attention - I don't dispute that, either. But going back to other fandoms, most people would agree it's inaccurate to judge the entire fandom by its revolting vocal minority... except in the case of true crime. For some reason, people are really down on the true crime genre and are far more willing to debate that tarring and feathering the whole genre is okay because Reasons. That strikes me as irrational and rather hypocritical.

[meadowphoenix]

I don't know what any of that has to do with what I said, which is that there are actually two distinct genres, physical crimes and psychological crime, broadly, and the fandom for psychological crime is more recent. And people saying something about "true crime" are very rightly not mentioning psychological crime, which isn't being marketed as the same thing.

so, let be more specific. When do you see the fandom aspects of non-physical crime beginning, such that you do think its wholly considered within the genre of "true crime" and people are fully ignoring that.

most people would agree it's inaccurate to judge the entire fandom by its revolting vocal minority
a) most people are in fact okay with judging fandoms by their loudest members. I don't really care if they say differently, nobody is looking a fandom from a holistic experience, they literally can't.
b) I don't think in experience-based situations that's incorrect or for the point of it all, inaccurate as a judgement, since the loudest people dictate the experience
b) you've said this isn't even the minority, so....