fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #5825 ]

There's a local Facebook group in my city for women that often functions as a safe space - something I appreciate even though I get judgy about the posts sometimes. Like, I support you, but fuck off with your MLM, it's not a "small business" and you're not an "entrepeneur". Also, who the fuck needs to go to Scentsy to obtain scented candles? Those fuckers are everywhere. Ditto essential oils, they don't cure shit and you don't need to get them from any kind of special source.

Because of the holidays there's an uptick in people stressing about the holidays, money, etc. and this one lady is just... sad. She bemoans the fact that she cannot find a job. (Disclaimer: this is a small town, but there are plenty of jobs, albeit customer service jobs.) When asked about her qualifications, she instead responds with a list of her job requisites which shows you exactly why she just "can't get hired anywhere". This is a grown ass woman who:

* does not drive, has no car or anyone who can give her a lift and will need an employer to "work with me on that".
* needs a job where she is "valued and loved" by her co-workers
* also wants to work alone because she's an introvert
* has undiagnosed ADHD/autism
* is okay with any wage as long as it's "reasonable" and she doesn't say what that entails
* really, really loves plants and her dream job is owning a houseplant store but she has no money to start one up so failing that, she'd love to work on a farm or taking care of plants somehow
* limited physical labor please, so only easy farm jobs, LOL
* only wants to work part time

Like... lady, beggars can't be choosers. Most people cannot and do not work jobs where they feel loved and valued and it fulfills them emotionally, they work because they need a paycheck. Maybe just get a job that pays the rent and find your bliss elsewhere?

I'm curious about the fourth point. How is the undiagnosed part being determined?

That part comes directly from her own words.

Oof. I've had and will probably always have mixed feeling about this.

As another anon stated, it can be very difficult for women to get an ASD diagnosis, especially in adulthood. On the other hand, I got diagnosed in childhood and got some treatment, at least enough to allow me to gain more skills and eventually independence. I still stim and have sound sensitivities, though, so my ASD didn't exactly disappear. I also received an ADHD diagnosis in my late teens and was prescribed Adderall. That was a nightmarish three months. That med made me rage; allowed me to only sleep four hours a night; and caused me to drop six pounds in a month. I had to beg to stop taking it, and I quit it cold turkey. To this day, I think the ADHD diagnosis was wrong.

Still, I sometimes feel like at least around women I have to announce my ASD traits in order for my ASD to he taken seriously. I feel like the rise of self-diagnosis has contributed to this (although how much is hard to gauge). When you autistic but have at least one formal diagnosis and have gained skills, being in the community as a woman can be tricky because you have a very different experience than others that can prevent you from being understood in the group. It's a no-win scenario for sure.

("another anon" here) may I ask how old you are, if it's not too intrusive?

Being a textbook autistic person who still didn't get diagnosed before adulthood, to me being a woman who got diagnosed as a child if you're over 30 is urban legend. But I got diagnosed with other stuff (common comorbidities so to speak) as a kid, prescribed harmful meds that made me rage much like you said (not the most social-life-favoring experience for an autistic girl in kindergarten if I had to say lol).

Unfortunately the indiscriminate handling of psychiatric diagnosis is common and bad for everyone, most of all the actual impaired people. Sorry you had to go through this. At the same time, ADHD is (and has been for a while) a popular diagnosis and it's weird and sad that even some professionals seem to believe that every executive dysfunction = ADHD (a possible reason for the rise in ADHD diagnosis alongside ASD ones). Sadly not everyone has means (finantial, intellectual or otherwise) to perceive "hey my diagnosis doesn't seem appropriate" and go after other opinions/docs. It's terrible that there are so many misdiagnosis but it's not patients' fault either. It's a complex matter.

AYRT

I'm almost 40 and recieved my ASD diagnosis (specifically PDD-NOS) in the late 80s. I'd have to ask my dad for the details, but I think I was able to get a diagnosis for a couple reasons. First, I had a loss of language skills and had a couple years of echolalia in my adulthood. Second, due to my language delays and behavior at day care (I once threw a rock at my instructor), the school district wanted to put me in special education. My parents objected to the prospect of me being in special ed. The school district ended up victorious in that one. This is all a huge contrast to my husband, whose autism was only diagnosed a couple years ago. He flew VERY under the radar and was a star pupil. Thus no one suspected anything. This is all to say that I know it's rare to be a grown woman with an early childhood diagnosis. Frankly, I'm tired of sharing my story showing how my experience is in fact real, but I know I have to keep going in order to make sure such invalidation doesn't continue to happen.

Your remark about "it's weird and sad that even some professionals seem to believe that every executive dysfunction = ADHD (a possible reason for the rise in ADHD diagnosis alongside ASD ones)" intrigues me, as I know more ND folks are going into psychology careers, especially in research. I wonder if that influx is driving this wave. I know it's a popular discussion on Autistic Instagram, so I am curious to see how all of these things are working together to drive this phenomenon.

SA

The "adulthood" in the first paragraph should be childhood.

AYRT - Oh, that makes a lot of sense actually. Sorry if it's tiring or hurtful for you to share it. Honestly I was just curious because I seldom meet adult women who managed to get diagnosed PDD in childhood and aren't severely impaired now (ie. non-verbal).

Some kinds of impairments are more evident than others, or rather more problematic behavior and I say this as someone who went through a few "problematic" phases. Language impairments are easily noticeable and "problematic" behavior even more of course. So it makes a lot of sense depending on where you live etc.

Hmm. Not sure myself. Growing up I had internet at home (in the 90-00s) and was a nerdy oddball with unspecific/unhelpful diagnosis, and researching psychology topics became a hobby for me. And I didn't know what I wanted to go to college for, so I got into a psychology bachelor program because I was interested in research, but also in new possibilities such as UX design. Of course becoming better at masking was a goal too though I wasn't aware of the concept of "masking" at that point. Something like that happened to me and I assume to many others who had a similar trajectory. But I doubt that has anything to do with the rise in certain diagnosis. To me it's more that sadly professionals haven't been interested enough in doing differential diagnosis as they should and instead choose to hand out diagnosis that are convenient for them (because they're getting paid to advertise meds or whatever else). It's not illegal, or even unethical to do something like that because in the end it's trial and error: a med may not work the same way for 2 people with the same (proper) diagnosis as etiology may not be the same. It's immoral but immoral can pay the bills too. But that's just my belief. And then there's a lot going on with research as well, how much the DSM has changed in recent years, how genetic studies are advancing and ethical aspects... there's a lot that could be said (and improved ofc) about it all.

Sorry but I have to say a couple of words about this.

First, I kind of get where you are coming from - there are comms like that around here too and some trends are... annoying? But there's nothing inherently wrong with things like scented candles or essential oils. As someone who's studied psychological effects of aromatherapy at college level there's not enough evidence *against* it so... if it works, it works, and really, there's nothing wrong. Maybe you need to take a break from this community if small things have been annoying you so much.

For everything else, as a grown woman who's pretty much bingo-ed that list I see nothing wrong. Maybe you don't want an explanation, but I will give some:

1- I have a license because my parents paid for it way back, but I can't have a car because money for a car/repairing/fuel/etc isn't something that comes easily for me right now and my disabilities make it so that I can HAVE AN EPILEPSY FIT AND CRASH AND KILL SOMEONE IN THE PROCESS while driving so it's not the best idea honestly. In short, "not everyone can drive honey"

2, 3, 4- As an ND and (newly diagnosed because I couldn't afford it before - you have NO idea how hard it is to get diagnosed as an adult woman) autistic person who's had to quit a few jobs because I was harassed by people even though I got the task done (and NTs who don't like you as a person WILL harass you lol) and is unemployed right now I can totally see why she might not want to go through it (again). It's a pain to struggle so much to learn the thing and "get along" only to have someone force you out of it, sometimes out of the career even, because they "dislike you" (and it's the small non-verbal things you have little control over) so it's a fair requirement. And this person doesn't seem to have done anything to you yet you don't like them and sound like you would try to make them quit their living wage job if you could. So there's that.

5- Quite fair taking into account how many employers nowadays are very unreasonable ??

6- That's called a special interest (or: a passion) and again I see nothing wrong with it, seeing as we often give our best when we like something? (Why do I have to explain anything this obvious?)

7, 8- Unfortunately autism also comes with physical impairments quite often. Or rather, sometimes there's a factor that accounts for both autism and physical impairments (source: lol guess). Personally I can't handle a full-time job. Trying would be bad for me and also for the poor employer who's gonna have me take sick leave upon sick leave and ultimately quit because my body can't take it. A part-time job is a possibility. What else do you want me to do? "Just do it" lol? Bitch.

It would be nice - and I would love it - if I could have a full-time job and find my bliss elsewhere. That was my goal as a student, to be able to pay the bills and have fun in fandom/arts at night. Then I worked really hard and landed a good job on my own, even coming from a poor background! And then gave up on all that because my health issues became unbearable. Unfortunately, only those with health issues get this. For everyone else (or: the vast majority of the planet) it's laziness at best sadly. The thing is, no one HAS to get it since LAWS protect people so that they can have the bare minimum even if others don't want them to. Such as labour laws and so on. But of course not all situations are covered. What I would hope for NTs to get is this: if you keep pushing a wall it won't bend because a wall is a wall so at best it will break. So, if the wall is useful somehow, in any way, in the great scope of things... don't push it?

Lastly, "beggars can't be choosers" is a pathetic arrogant statement in any context, but that's just my opinion.

Yes! This!
I stuck at a low-paying job because of good hours and still my health is fucking useless shit and I don't know what to do.
Also this car thing is the most American thing ever. People shouldn't need to operate heavy machinery that can easily become deadly to have a job. This is some scary shit

DA

“Also this car thing is the most American thing ever. People shouldn't need to operate heavy machinery that can easily become deadly to have a job. This is some scary shit”

As an American, fucking this. I had to learn to drive just to get around, even though I was terrified to do it then, and I still hate it now. I was told it would get easier, so easy it would be second nature. It’s been decades and that’s never happened. But public transportation is awful in America, and just as expensive if not more than driving depending on where you live. So driving is all some people can do, and it sucks. My brother has epilepsy, but before he was diagnosed, he was afraid of driving so never finished taking lessons. It was expected of him to eventually get over his fear and do it, “because that’s what adults do”. But then he started getting seizures, and now him having an epilepsy diagnosis means he doesn’t have to drive. But I think people should have respected his wishes to not have to even when it was just a fear. Driving isn’t bad for everyone, but not everyone should have to it they don’t want to. But the economy here is so dependent on cars and gasoline that public transportation will never get better. They even got rid of perfectly good train lines that already existed to make more roads for driving, and now trains are almost always just for cargo.

I say it with absolute sincerity, this is awful and I feel you. I don't have vendetta against cars and there are a lot of places in my country where cars are essential. But there should be a choice!
I hate car culture so much. We have quite developed public transportation, but still through my life I've been pressured into driving. It's an adult thing you Have To Do. Fuck this

People shouldn't need to operate heavy machinery that can easily become deadly to have a job.

You don't have to. I haven't owned a car in more than ten years. BUT you also can't live in a place where a car is necessary to get around and then complain that you're expected to have a car to be able to get around. There are plenty of places out there where a car is in fact not necessary to be able to get a job.

NA

Ehhh, that assumes they have the means to go somewhere where a car isn't necessary. I'd say in most of the US, you absolutely do need a car. The US is very much a country built around people driving cars.

You need money to move. To get money, you either have to be lucky enough to have a family that finances your move, or you need a job. If you're in a place where you need a car to get a job and you can't drive, you can't make money. So you can't move to a place where a car isn't necessary either.

You make it sound as if living in a place where you need a car is a choice. I think that's true for only a small amount of people.

Not OP

"But there's nothing inherently wrong with things like scented candles or essential oils. As someone who's studied psychological effects of aromatherapy at college level there's not enough evidence *against* it so... if it works, it works, and really, there's nothing wrong."

The scented candles bit is one thing. However, the essential oils bit is another. A numbercof people invooved in MLM distribution of them are making health claims about what can be treated/cured with essential oils, and these recipes include swallowing said oils or rubbing directly onto your skin. The oral and topical applications are even recommended for children. Given how essenrial oils can be at the very least skin irritants, this strikes me as pretty irresponsible.

And why are these recommendations being made? The MLM model allows it, ecen encourages it to boost sales/recruitment numbers. Really, that ends up being the biggest issue with any MLM business. It's about the product so much as it is about the unethical (and sometimes straight up illegal) business practices.

AYRT - oh, okay. There's no pyramid selling of essential oils here (as someone who's used them a few times I hate that there isn't, because it's hard to get them ready-made and I have to order them in advance lol) so I wasn't aware, thanks for letting me know.

(On the other hand, the "children" bit... well, they're prescribing strong psychiatric meds for kids. In that sense I still feel like essential oils are less of a harm tbh.)

Anyone who would treat a child's psychiatric issues by feeding them essential oils, despite the fact that they are not processed in a way to keep them safe from contaminants, are not meant to be eaten at all, and are not known in any way, shape or form to treat psychiatric issues, should never have access to children.

"Rubbing on skin" isn't the same as "eating" though. And whoever said they should be used to treat psychiatric issues, dude? All I said is that they're testing far more harmful chemicals on kids. And that didn't stop them from trying.

Dunno, there are a lot of distributors advocating for people of all ages to eats the oils, as per the FDA's findings.

https://www.fda.gov/inspections-compliance-enforcement-and-criminal-investigations/warning-letters/young-living-essential-oils-corporate-615777-06102022

Also NAYRT, but AYRT never said there was anything wrong with scented candles and essential oils. They said there's something wrong with the MLMs that peddle them. And, even putting aside the entirely legit concerns that another anon raised about how most of the essential oils MLMs are advocating doing frankly dangerous things with their products (please don't eat essential oils or put them on your pets), pyramid schemes are predatory and exploitative.

[ SECRET POST #5825 ]

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