Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
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fandomsecrets2009-05-30 04:22 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2009-05-30 04:22 pm
[ SECRET POST #876 ]
⌈ Secret Post #876 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 21 pages, 518 secrets from Secret Submission Post #126.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 4 - not!secrets ], [ 1 2 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2009-05-31 10:55 am (UTC)(link)"Do not have sex with a man as you would with a woman. It is an abomination."
And in Leviticus 20:13:
"If a man has sex with a man in same way as with a woman, they have committed an abomination. They are certainly to be put to death. Their blood is on their own heads."
You're saying these laws don't really condemn homosexuality, and I'm genuinely interested to know how that works. Is there something we should understand about the culture of the time? Do these passages mean something entirely different in the original hebrew?
Jesus doesn't really seem to have anything against the old laws, either. Am I reading this wrong? Matthew 5:17-18:
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2009-05-31 02:34 pm (UTC)(link)eg Leviticus 18:22
King James: "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."
Living Bible: "Homosexuality is absolutely forbidden, for it is an enormous sin"
New Living Translation: "Do not practice homosexuality; it is a detestable sin."
The word ("to'ebah") translated as 'abomination' literally refers to 'something which is deemed ritually unclean', which also applies to other things such as eating food which contains both meat and dairy products, a Jew having a meal with an Egyptian. It does not refer to moral violations, which would be referred to as "zimah."
What they translated as 'in the same way as with a woman', actually says 'in a woman's bed'. There is also actually no word for 'homosexual' in the Bible, only for 'male prostitute', which is often wrongly translated as simply 'homosexual'.
The other commonly used passages refer to rape and prostitution, there is nothing about committed homosexual relationships.
You might study in detail the original and still come to the conclusion that you think it condemns homosexuality, but personally I don't understand why people take a translation as fact without knowing what the original really says.
I hope this helps you see that it is not as straightforward as you might think.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_bibh5.htm
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no subject
(Anonymous) 2009-05-31 04:37 pm (UTC)(link)I suspected there would be some controversy about those lines in Leviticus, this is interesting, thank you for the info and the link. I still think that in the context that it's in it reads most logically as "God thinks two men having sex is gross and it should be punished by death", but it's admittedly not as straightforward as it sounds. But if the meaning is different, the whole chapter could have been worded better - in the original, too.
Also Paul seems to describe gay sex, both between men and women, in Romans 1 as "totally unnatural and icky", but then again, for example, I don't think Sodom was said to be destroyed because of homosexual activity and the Bible really doesn't seem to have an opinion on homosexuality itself, just sexual intercourse between people of the same gender. It still doesn't sound good.
I'm only being difficult because I don't completely understand the logic here, but I really shouldn't complain. Supporting gay rights is always awesome.
no subject