fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #5964 ]

[ SECRET POST #5964 ]

⌈ Secret Post #5964 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[Murdoch Mysteries]

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06. [SPOILERS for Reservation Dogs, season 2]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 00 secrets from Secret Submission Post #852.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

AYRT

Reply to all 3 above -

I lived in the middle of bumfuck nowhere religiousville, so guess what kind of shows the stations there would play. We were also poor. No cable for me.

Also, I finally did see Buffy once I got to college; it bored the crap out of me.

Different DA - your experience of media then is hardly representative of a whole trend. It explains your personal feelings, sure, and that makes sense, but not, as you said, "most female characters"

+Billions

NAYRT

But they're not claiming to represent "trends." Since when does anyone's experience have to be normal or statistically average to belong on fandom!secrets?

Their claim was that female characters just AREN'T well-written. Not some, not the ones they know, not even most. All female characters.

AYRT

When someone says "it's like so," I assume they are talking about what they've come across. I also assume they've got something to contribute.

If it's possible to make your way through life in the US in the 21st century and be exposed to overwhelmingly conservative gender roles on television, just because you're poor and rural, I think that's at least as important as other anons assuming they must have done it to themselves by shunning all the good media with cool female characters.

There's a difference between "in my experience" statements, which the bumfuck comments elaborated on and which I have no quarrel with, and the original comment I was responding it, which was all-encompassing. Obviously people with different experiences have different perspectives, but that's why it's important to not come in with "well all coffee sucks because /I/ don't like bitter drinks"

AYRT

>That's why it's important to not come in with "all coffee sucks because /I/ don't like bitter drinks."

We can agree on that.

But if the person you've been talking to is the OP of the secret, what they said was "Genshin is the first fandom where I like any het ships." And if they're not, their saying that most female characters 'are written as female first and characters maybe, and less so now than when [they] were younger but not enough that [they] want to ship these people' ... seems entirely like an owned opinion to me.

They might not be thinking of a hundred TV shows that you've seen and they haven't that would contradict their opinion. Fair. But there is no "you must dedicate THIS much leisure time to watching television" to have feelings about pop culture and speak up, here. This isn't a focus group for the industry. It's a fandom gathering spot.

1) there's no indication that this is the OP of the secret. I am addressing only the "female characters are badly written" claim, not the "I've had bad luck with female characters" claim. The first one is not phrased as a subjective statement.

2) at no point have I said there's a required viewing list, the hell are you on about. If someone says "fact: there is no McDonalds in New York City", someone else is allowed to come in and say "you're objectively wrong", because the first person who has only seen one block in NYC, for whatever personal reasons they have, made an incorrect and sweeping statement.

AYRT

Someone who wanted to say "you are wrong" would do well to point to evidence keyed to the actual claim being made. The thing being discussed wasn't "no good female characterizations," it was more like, "no women in media that I want to write or ship." For years, fandom has doubled down on the assumption that if you feel this way, you're either defective or closed-minded, without giving serious consideration to the fact that it could also be a problem with the writing.

It's also possible that people who want stuff they aren't getting out of most media are having a hard enough time locating it that they've given up on "watching American shows" in their free time. And therefore are more likely to run into it elsewhere, if they run into it at all.

As the person of controversy in this thread:

You have explained it exactly. I never thought that anyone would think that someone saying "There aren't any female characterizations that I want to read about or ship; I find them lacking for this reason" was the same as "All female characters suck". Like, honestly. No one has seen EVERY show that has even ONE female character. Ain't nobody got time for that.

You are also correct that I have basically given up American media. I find much better character writing elsewhere.

Also, for the record: I am not secret!OP.

AYRT

Not... not really:

https://thetvprofessor.com/the-history-of-working-women-as-seen-on-tv/
https://sites.gatech.edu/1102tvfem/2018/09/20/changes-in-womens-careers-portrayed-by-popular-television-throughout-time-john-ryu/
https://womenintvfilm.sdsu.edu/files/2014-15_Boxed_In_Report.pdf
https://scholarworks.uark.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?referer=&httpsredir=1&article=1001&context=jouruht
https://www.indiewire.com/news/general-news/sorry-ladies-study-on-women-in-film-and-television-confirms-the-worst-65220/

Gosh darn I guess women just NEVER EVER get written well and fandom just HAS to go on only paying attention to male characters who are always written SO much better

That's not what they said and not what's implied by it.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #5964 ]

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