[ SECRET POST #6147 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6147 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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[A Practical Guide to Evil]



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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 32 secrets from Secret Submission Post #879.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

"I'm not gonna strawman OP by assuming what they mean, but here's a bunch of stuff that I assume they mean, and here's my argument against that."

[(Anonymous)]

I'd be like "read the comment again" but I can tell you were invested in not reading it properly the first time so I think that'd be moot, haha

[(Anonymous)]

You said "I'm not gonna assume this is what OP meant, but 100% this is what people who say this always mean."

I'm not really sure what you think reading the comment "properly" would change about that impression.

[(Anonymous)]

Sigh, ok. Here's me reading the comment for you.

"I'm not going to assume OP means keep gay/trans/non-white people out of fandom for being political. I assume most fandomers are liberal so that is not what they mean."

However.

"I AM going to assume that when OP says 'keep politics out of fandom' they do mean 'politics = whatever I personally, arbitrarily deem political, whatever that means'" because there's no other way to interpret that phrase.

Can you tell me what OP considers political, without being OP? What does political mean? Are you sure you and OP agree on all fronts? What happens if you don't?

[(Anonymous)]

+1000

[(Anonymous)]

If OP and I don't agree on all fronts, then what happens is that...we don't agree on all fronts? Other than that, not much.

What happens when you don't agree with people on all fronts?

[(Anonymous)]

I mean if you're gonna agree to "keep politics out of fandom" you should probably agree on what those politics are, lol.

What are politics to OP? How can you agree with them to "keep politics out of fandom" without knowing that?

[(Anonymous)]

It sounds like politics is a meaningless word.

[(Anonymous)]

Sure. Now tell me how anyone can keep "politics" out of fandom when no one can say what an agreed-upon definition of "politics" is.

Unless you say "politics is only what I personally, arbitrarily say it is and nothing else counts even if it's political to someone else" you can't. And if you say that, everyone will disagree with you anyway.

That's the whole point. It's A) impossible and B) intrinsically self-centered to demand

[(Anonymous)]

+1000 again.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not worried about that at all. I'm worried about what it means for any political endeavor that the word "political" is meaningless.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

The word "political" isn't meaningless. People are just stupid and include a bunch of stuff that isn't political in with it. So, unfortunately, we have to deal with them saying stuff like "equal rights for queers is political". And then we get someone saying that we should keep politics out of fandom, and we can't tell what they mean by politics.

[(Anonymous)]

But equal rights for any group is very much political, in that it involves power relations and status as mediated by the state. The movement to legalize gay marriage was political. The movement to make sexual orientation-based discrimination illegal was political. This does not imply that LGBT people do not deserve equal rights; it implies only that the process of obtaining those rights involved politics.

[(Anonymous)]

AYRT

Thank you for proving my point.

What politics are:
Should we put a roundabout or a stop light in this intersection?
Should we open up zoning to create more affordable housing?
We have a limited budget, should we do this thing A to help underserved population B? Or thing C to help underserved population D?
Shall we raise taxes for this period of time for the purposes of levying funds to provide this benefit to the community?

What politics aren't:
Should we treat everyone like human beings with self determination and the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness?
Should we stop intersex and trans kids from playing sports in their schools?
Etc.

Unfortunately, a lot of people seem to think that other people's humanity are up for political debate. So now we have to treat them like they are. And it's sick.

[(Anonymous)]

The notion that everyone should have the right to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" (which is specifically American phrasing) is absolutely a political question. Throughout most of human history, it has not been the case; in fact, it was not the case in the US for a good century after US politicians jotted it down, and it continues not to be the case in many, many places in the world. How has that been addressed in the past, and how will it be addressed going forward? Through politics -- through people gaining some degree of control over and effecting change through the political system.

It's the state that ensures the protection of our rights. For that reason, rights will always be a political matter.

[(Anonymous)]

If you're not worried about that at all, I guess there's no more conversation to be had about this secret in particular.

GL with your concerns.

[(Anonymous)]

This is smug and incurious.

[(Anonymous)]

Sorry, there's just no conversation to be had here, and I have no particular interest or interesting reactions to your musing concernedly to yourself or whatever. HF?

[(Anonymous)]

But I'm not musing concernedly to myself. I'm musing aloud, in order to talk about it. And for some reason, you're acting like a smug dick in response.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

You're not, actually. Look deep into your heart, you know this to be true.

Have fun living with yourself.

[(Anonymous)]

What?