fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #6328 ]

[ SECRET POST #6328 ]

⌈ Secret Post #6328 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02. [SPOILERS for Civil War (2024)]

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03. [SPOILERS for Ghost of Tsushima]

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04. [SPOILERS for Detective Conan]
[WARNING for discussion of incest]

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05. [WARNING for discussion of sex with a minor/statutory rape]

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06. [WARNING for discussion of domestic violence]

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07. [WARNING for discussion of JKR/transphobia]

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08. [WARNING for discussion of sexual assault]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 00 secrets from Secret Submission Post #904.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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Are women who don't want to be around people who have penises because people who have penises have assaulted them bigots? Should they be forced to share space with people who have penises?

That's dumb because people aren't just their genitals. They're human beings with the capability of making a choice, and Anyone can make a choice to be violent to other people - including women (and 5 years of hell in an all-girls school has shown me that fun experience that I can't ever tell anyone because people don't believe that women could ever harm a fly unless there's hard evidence that's probably going to get disregarded anyways).

You are applying logic to an illogical reaction. PTSD and emotional trauma dont follow logic.

DA

And PTSD and trauma sucks. But that doesn't mean that trans people don't have a right to be who they are. If a white person was traumatized by a black person in some way and now finds seeing black people traumatic, that wouldn't make it okay to segregate again. Trans people exist. trans women are women and trans men are men. And they should get to live their lives and be themselves.

And frankly, trans people often have a whole lot of trauma because of being forced to be something they are not, judged, bullied, and attacked just for being themselves. Their trauma is just as real.

DA

But the fact is that males and females are different from each other in a way that white and black people are not, and neither trans women nor trans men can ever escape the fact that their underlying biology is at odds with their gender. That is, after all, why they are trans to begin with.

And to a certain extent, we all tacitly acknowledge this. You're not objecting, here, to segregating according sex, right? It's not the fact that there are shelters specifically for women that's at issue, even though their very existence is predicated on the idea that if a woman has suffered at the hands of and been traumatized by a man, she ought to have a space where she can get away from men. What do you supposed that's based on?

DA

The problem with trying to talk about the specific issue of women's shelters and illogical trauma responses is that the whole reason it came up in the first place is because transphobes want to draw much larger and stupider conclusions from that topic. What kind of policy makes sense for responding to someone's trauma in a very limited specific context is not actually relevant to the broader bigoted conclusions transphobes want to draw.

Well its a slippery slide to just reduce people down to their body parts. Maybe dehumanizing is a side affect of trauma, but that doesn't mean people should suffer for it - NO MATTER WHO.

DA

Should we get rid of women's shelters altogether, then?

I'm sorry that your reading skills are so piss-poor that you read DEHUMANIZING PEOPLE IS WRONG NO MATTER WHAT, into DUR HURR LETS GET RID OF WOMENS SHELTERS. Shame on you.

So answer the question then.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-05-06 01:58 (UTC) - Expand

Have you stopped beating your wife?

Not until morale improves

hi. I have PTSD.

It's my job to manage it, not make everyone conform themselves to it.

It is the genitals and the threat of rape that are the concern in places like domestic violence refuges.
It is the overall physicality of biological men playing women's sports that is the issue, regardless of genitals.
Women are far more abused by men than by women.

Fascinating. You took 'Does hating a group of people count when involving hating a group of people' and turned it into 'But what if someone is forced into doing THIS'. Hope you get to be a better human than whatever you're rotting into someday in the future. Have fun with arguing with strangers on the internet, don't forget to drink water!

Someone who has a traumatic response because of an experience where they were assaulted isn't a bigot. To the extent that's possible, we should absolutely try to figure out ways to accommodate their trauma.

Someone who wants to cynically use that trauma to justify their own bigotry and reconstruct the entirety of society to exclude certain people based on that - THOSE people clearly are just bigots. Trauma isn't a rational fact or a justification for bigotry.

This. Normal women's shelters should be able to accommodate both trans women and women who are uncomfortable around anyone with a penis. And you know what would help them find the best ways to do that? Funding! Making an entire new exclusive shelter for cis women only is impractical and the motive absolutely does not end with wanting women with a specific trauma to feel safe.

NA - I agree with what you're saying here, but the one thing I genuinely have never understood is why so many people feel so certain that this: the motive absolutely does not end with wanting women with a specific trauma to feel safe. is true for someone like JKR. When I read her essay back in 2019 or whatever year it was, I absolutely came away from it with the impression that her motive was wanting women, especially those with a specific trauma, to feel, and be, as safe as possible. She seemed sincere to me. I did not get the impression that oppression was her goal, at all.

I came away with the impression that there were certain things to do with the reality of trans politics, trans oppression, and trans experiences that she was confused and/or mistaken and/or ignorant about, and that her misapprehensions had the potential to be damaging to an at-risk population. But I never got the impression she was less than sincere in her belief (wrong though it was) that she was advocating for a cause that was constructive and would prevent more harm that it caused.

(I'm not saying that remains true to this day. I don't really keep up with everything JKR does and says these days.)

I am fairly certain it is not true of JKR now, and more to the point I am pretty damn confident it is not true of the people making anti-trans arguments ITT.

Out of curiosity... HOW would a woman know if there's a trans woman in the shelter who is pre-op? Because if the issue is "having a penis", post-op transwomen don't have one.

And HOW is this even enforceable? Are they going to CHECK? How is THAT not traumatizing, even if you're a cis woman? Also, if you're a cis woman with a male child, are you forbidden from this shelter? After all, your child has a penis, and terfs like Rowling seem to want to keep all those evil penises away from traumatized women, so... of you go to a different shelter IF you're lucky?

They hypothetical male child argument would probably just be used by TERFs as proof that trans people are predators because you're thinking about a child having a penis.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2024-05-04 16:24 (UTC) - Expand

Do you really think trans women start to look like cis women as soon as they're in their HTR? Sweet summer child.

JKR has turned her trauma into a bludgeon and I legitimately hope she keels over and ends up in a hospital and unable to write anything the rest of her days from how much stress she gives herself. Not even a single tweet. Silence, eternally. And she can die in the agony of her irrelevance when she can no longer scream her way into spotlight with bigotry, racism and ableism.

Ah, yes, wishing injury, pain and death onto women whose opinions you don't share. Classic.

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