[ SECRET POST #6551 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6551 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 06 secrets from Secret Submission Post #936.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I mean, I'd also be annoyed if I was reading F/F and there was surprise penis in that, because that wouldn't be what I had been expecting or looking for when I went to find F/F.

NAYRT

[(Anonymous)]

Thinking of this one Omegaverse book that had the warning “G!P” on the sale page. Lots of angry reviews from people who didn’t know that meant “girl penis.”

Re: NAYRT

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, that's... not a very common tag.

[(Anonymous)]

DA, but yeah. This too. I've wondered if the overall lack of biological men writing fanfiction in most of my fandoms plays a role in there being a lot more surprise!vagina than surprise!penis, to be honest.

[(Anonymous)]

My experience has been that for whatever reason, people tend to be good about tagging for girlpenis and recognizing that it isn't something that everyone wants to read. Not so much the other way around for boypussy.

[(Anonymous)]

da

If the writers are largely cis women and transmasculine people, they might get their own body issues triggered by acknowledging that not everyone is comfortable with vaginas. I think this is part of it for some people who don't want to tag. The reality of misogynistic hatred of female bodies and the reality of some people simply just being averse to vaginas overlap in uncomfortable ways sometimes. And there is an additional element of reacting to transphobia for trans authors, or homophobia for queer female authors, etc. I do sympathize with these feelings but trolling by not tagging and trying to start fights over not everyone sharing your preference for vagina-centric erotica is a waste of time and energy.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

When people are looking at strangers with mistrust and bad faith, though, you could just as easily accuse the people shoving M/F into gay fics and refusing to tag of being Christians who hate that fandom incites people to imagine pairings their religion considers inherently sinful and unnatural. I don't think that's what it is, but it's equally unjustified to be scrutinizing everyone who doesn't want to read about vaginas with the belief that they're bigots, or at least indistinguishable from bigots.

Fandom has a very high proportion of female writers and readers. And somehow, for a long time, it got along with the assumption that wanting to read about one thing didn't mean you hated and wished ill on everything that wasn't that. People had to actively do a belligerent thing to be judged for it. AFAIK, no one was responding to the existence of slash or the fact that some writers only wrote slash with "how dare you fail to make me feel good about having a vagina?!" Then, a bunch of people who apparently thought fandom was an inexcusably apolitical of womens' free time threw fits. And, sooner or later, I'm expecting fandom to get collectively fed up with being nagged to write about things they never had any innate desire to write about, and rediscover the joys of I Do This For Me and Don't Like, Don't Read.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

AFAIK, no one was responding to the existence of slash or the fact that some writers only wrote slash with "how dare you fail to make me feel good about having a vagina?!"

Slash writers in the 90s got accused of being misogynistic all the time because if you didn't hate women you would write about them having sex. They still are, but this time the call is coming from inside the house (people who claim to like F/F). Basically the same thing.

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

Idk if you misread my comment to think I don't agree with you, or if you're just adding additional thoughts. I think it's immature and as I said, a waste of time and energy to throw a fit over others not liking what you like, even if I sympathize with where the defensiveness comes from.

I do somewhat disagree that this is a new issue. I remember this same type of argument a decade ago, fifteen years ago... about other fandom trends. Though it can be harder to avoid on today's social media for sure. People can be insecure about their preferences and unnecessarily make it into a moral judgement thing, this is common IME. Recall the debates ten years ago (that still come up sometimes today) about whether preferring slash is sexist because it doesn't prioritize female characters or whatever? I remember former fandom friends causing plenty of pointless drama about how it's misogynistic to only write "dudeslash" LOL.

Overall though, I certainly don't think insecurity is a valid reason to call those who don't share your preference bigoted, and didn't mean to suggest otherwise.

[(Anonymous)]

It doesn't even have anything to do with "hating" female bodies, though. I'm a cis straight woman. I have zero interest in reading about sex involving vaginas because if I wanted that, I would just go have sex. I get plenty of that in my actual life! I want to read about the stuff that I can't experience for myself that I also find hot, namely two hot dudes getting it on.

That's literally it. There's no deeper meaning to it than that.

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

Good for you, I wholeheartedly support that. I don't think it has anything to do with hating female bodies either. I don't think the preference has a deeper meaning for many people or should. Perhaps I worded my comment poorly. My intentions were to comment on how some people in fandom use their fandom as an outlet for dealing with misogyny in real life, such as by baselessly insisting people who don't share their preference are sexist or transphobic.

[(Anonymous)]

Back in my day, they use to tag that as futanari.

[(Anonymous)]

And in between, there was girldick.

The fact that you need to tag for umpteen different unassociated terms on the AO3 (and however many new ones people make up) to convey "I want my M/M with two cocks and no vaginas," is a pain, though.

[(Anonymous)]

I do wonder what fandoms these are. Not that I don't believe its happening (there's a crapton of fandoms that I'm not in and don't know what its like), but the few fandoms I've been in where someone forgets to tag there's always been people commenting to point that out and asking to put the tag in.
I guess it depends what the fandom space is like for the fandoms where these things are happening. If people don't bother to comment then yeah I can see why it keeps happening, or if its someone thinking everyone 'knows' about the character (someone pointed out a case with a character from Trigun canonically not having genitals and having this issue in that fandom a while ago).

[(Anonymous)]

You wonder which fandoms you have to use a long and cumbersome list of tags on in order to effectively filter this out? When the AO3 insists on a tagging system that makes it hard to see what all the relevant tags other people have already used even are, and encourages authors to write in whatever they feel like?

[(Anonymous)]

Well there's a lot of fandoms and I'm not in every single one of them to see every problem with every fantom tag.
I guess I've been lucky.

[(Anonymous)]

Futanaris aren't real though, whereas transsexuals are. Maybe the futa tag shouldn't be mixed in with trans tags?