[ SECRET POST #6990 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6990 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 18 secrets from Secret Submission Post #998.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

06. https://cdn.imgchest.com/files/ad3895939ad4.png

Transcript by OP

[fscom]

I wish more fans were open to admitting that they want heavily moderated, fans-only, positivity-only, dissenters-are-banned spaces for their faves, ships, idols, whatever. There's nothing wrong with such clearly delineated spaces and honestly I think that would solve a lot of problems.

But whenever it's suggested, so many of them seem to look down on those spaces, refuse to look for them, and won't admit that's what they want out of fandom, even if they complain about 'haters' and 'antis' existing around them 24/7. Like they want that kind of space, but only unofficially, because... idk?

Is it some kind of misplaced pride?

Re: Transcript by OP

[(Anonymous)]

Oh, I'll scream it from the rooftops. I don't look down on closed spaces. Not every piece of media is meant for everyone's eyes, and not every space dedicated to that media needs to be set up the same.

It's absolutely fucking nice when all the toxic people aren't around. The difference is night and day. Not to say there aren't some conflicts but with reasonable people, they get resolved quickly.

I'll admit I'm lousy at finding those spaces these days, because they are either dead/barely active or don't exist at all. Not to say I haven't found a comm or two, I'm just saying it isn't always easy.

[(Anonymous)]

That's something I miss from ye olde days. Granted, we had to be secretive and exclusive 'cause I was in the slasher coms, but we kept our communities to people who all had the same fave or pairing or even t/b designation and it was (mostly) a peaceful time (within the community).

[(Anonymous)]

I think about this every so often.

"Why are people here criticizing my fave?"

Well, is criticism actually banned?
If not, why isn't it?
If it is banned, where are your mods?
If your mods aren't doing anything, where are the complaints against them?
If they won't listen, why are you still there?

[(Anonymous)]

My favorite thing ever is when someone makes a post about something, puts very general tags on it that makes it appear across a broad swathe of fandom, and then when someone responds to it with even mild disagreement, the OP goes, "WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING ON MY BLOG, WHY ARE YOU REBLOGGING THIS POST, AND HOW DARE YOU ADD YOUR THOUGHTS." Like dude, were you not aware of how public posts and tags work? Or is it that you want the whole fandom to see your opinion, bu not be allowed to engage with it?

[(Anonymous)]

They don't want their own space. They want all spaces to be the way the want them to be and for all the bad people to either stop doing fandom wrong or go away.

[(Anonymous)]

Correct! Just like people who complain about certain content existing, even if it's fully tagged so they can avoid it. They don't want a safe space, they want the world to be their safe space to affirm how good and correct and normal their beliefs are.

[(Anonymous)]

That is really weird. I only do fandom on Reddit these days and honestly it’s so nice. I love being surrounded by people who love the thing I love and talking about how much we love the thing we love. It’s the closest I’ve found to the days of LJ. If someone comes along to troll or fight or whatever, the mods just ban them and delete their bullshit. Sometimes a lot of us are able to downvote it first so their karma gets tanked.

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, I like it for that reason!

I don't really do Reddit much for shippy stuff, though, just things I'm a fan of and want to discuss the lore, like for The Pitt.

I do use Twitter for fandom stuff and just mute idiots/antis.

[(Anonymous)]

I agree, these should be more common. My fandom has at least one of those places (defined as "low sodium") and it's nice, really. Everyone knows what to expect there.

[(Anonymous)]

I absolutely miss this. If anyone knows of places like this, pls let me know? Tumblr has communities now, but it's not quite taking off.

Someone else mentioned Reddit, do others have similar positive experiences there?

[(Anonymous)]

My few experiences in fandom specific communities on reddit were ruined by anti mods.

[(Anonymous)]

reddit highly depends on the fandom. for example, I won't touch any of the One Piece subs, they're all unhinged. some gaming subs are really great and some are toxic bullshit. okbuddybaldur is hilarious.

[(Anonymous)]

Absolutely. Reddit varies so much per subreddit that it's hard to give any generalizations on it. One fandom might have a great, welcoming, friendly community, while another is insular and you have to stick with the hivemind or you'll be downvoted and ignored, and another has a crazy tyrant of a mod and is fine unless you get on their bad side. I do feel like in general *most* large subreddits get to the point where they kind of suck unless the mods micromanage and heavily moderate everything, but that's not even always necessarily the case.

[(Anonymous)]

This is exactly how LJ was and basically every fandom place that isn’t tumblr or twitter.

[starfleetbrat]

I've had mixed fandom experiences on reddit, it really depends on the fandom.

I left one subreddit because it was kinda toxic in terms of hating on the lead female character but putting the male character on a pedestal, but other subreddits have been a positive experience with good episode discussion and active mods who keep things on track etc.

Its definitely worth checking out some of the subreddits and seeing if they are good or not.

[(Anonymous)]

Hm... I don't know, I think for a while it's because Tumblr/Twitter were the only places where you could do fandom, and both sites have no moderation, it's very difficult to control who sees what, only informal norms about what you should/shouldn't post in commonly used tags (on Tumblr, which are entangled with a mechanism people use for organizing their blogs and making their own posts findable to them again...) and what you should/shouldn't put as a reply to a stranger's post, and only recent somewhat better controls on how to control replies and spread of your posts.

Heavily-moderated Discords ARE a lot more popular nowadays, so people are going off and creating the heavily-moderated spaces you're saying people don't want to create... But the reason you probably don't hear about them is because Discords are also less public and you usually need a private invite in order to get in.

Even now, I enjoy Tumblr so little I barely use it, but I'm having difficulty deleting it entirely because it's usually the one and only place people will go to talk to you if they read your fic on AO3 and want to start up a conversation with you. "Like my fic? Join my private proship Discord or friend me on Dreamwidth where I post more about my creative process" is uh not something I've gotten any takers on, I gotta say.

Anyway, what I'm saying is that I'm 100% someone who is all in favor of moderated spaces with clearly delineated rules about what can and can't be posted. (I am, however, NOT a positivity-only type person because I like positive and critical discussion and this is usually why I keep reblogs on on pretty much all my posts -- I LIKE discussion, and that can't happen if everyone has the exact same opinion/interpretation/reaction to our shared fandom. At the same time, I also think if you want to dish it out, you should be able to take it. If e.g. you're going to talk about how people who ship x bother you because [list of reasons] in the main fandom tag, you should be willing to countenance replies strongly disagreeing with you and telling you you're wrong without throwing a fit. Like, negativity is OK but also it for obvious reasons starts fights and if you don't want to get in a fight then don't be negative in a place where that will start a fight and then get shocked because there wasn't a rule against being negative in public.) I have even made such heavily-moderated spaces myself. But also there is value to the public unmoderated spaces that make it so that people still often have to use them (e.g. if they want to find the private moderated spaces in the first place...). Even though I agree with your prescription and do it myself, I don't think practically speaking this removes my ability to have to use unmoderated spaces and my frustrations when I do. Theoretically, fandom could just en masse use the heavily moderated spaces by default. It does not, though.

Anyway, I agree with you that more people should openly want spaces like this. I do think, though, that people ARE creating those spaces more and more (even though you may not see them). This doesn't remove fandom's heavy reliance on unmoderated spaces, though, nor will it eliminate the phenomenon that when you post negative opinions in a fandom tag you will likely get yelled at by other fans, because that's how being in a fandom works. Like, even in a space with no moderation and no rules, if you act like a jerk to other people -- surprise, surprise -- you will be treated like you are a jerk and socially punished for this.

I also think conflating a "heavily moderated" and "fans-only" space with "positivity-only" and "no-dissent" is itself really problematic and probably why you don't get any take-up when you make this suggestion to other people... The whole reason for heavy moderation and membership requirements/vetting IMO is so that some amount of negativity and dissent/disagreement can happen between fans without it spiraling into something toxic or actively dangerous (e.g. doxxing). I don't see moderation and negativity/disagreement as opposed; rather, I think unmoderated spaces are the type of spaces that get terrified assent and sheep mentality because people cannot safely disagree.

[(Anonymous)]

SA

I should also add that you can still get terrified assent and sheep mentality in heavily moderated spaces too. It really depends on the mod and the rules they've set up. As is clear from the variety in Reddit spaces, you can get tyrant mods or anti mods who make it very dangerous to disagree with the majority. So moderation isn't some guarantee against groupthink either, but in my opinion, it is a prerequisite to enabling people to disagree safely. You still have to be careful about who the mod is and what rules they've set up, and how the members tend to interact, though. Moderation isn't a silver bullet.