[ SECRET POST #6997 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6997 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 22 secrets from Secret Submission Post #999.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

04. https://cdn.imgchest.com/files/baa1f69318fe.png

Transcript by OP

[fscom]

I always thought that asking the British Public to accept a girl as Doctor was going to be an ask too far, but I feel that an ethnic Doctor would have been acceptable if they'd chosen an Indian man and he wasn't coming off a girl Doctor. Forcing them both together has just crashed the franchise into a wall. It was sheer arrogance on the part of Moffat and RTD.

[(Anonymous)]

It was the incredibly terrible writing, plot, and character work, that turned me off of Doctor Who, not that the person playing the doctor was a woman.

[(Anonymous)]

That was slightly true for 13, the plots and writing were terrible, though the characters were great. But for 15? Not terrible at all, really good until the most recent episode.

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

tbh, I stopped watching after her. The character assassination they did was just a point of no return for me. I meant to start watching again with the new guy, but I never got around to it.
Did they end up just retconning the whole 'not a timelord' and other mistakes they made, do you know?

[(Anonymous)]

Tt was Chibnall who cast Jodie Whittaker and RTD cast Ncuti Gatwa, not Moffat's choices... I also agree with the other commenter that it was the writing that turned me off the show, but I can't speak for the viewing public at large.

[(Anonymous)]

I stand by the fact that about 70% of the writing for both Doctors were Really Bad.
There's only so much that either actor could carry.
Plus, Gatwa was missing from a good handful of the series and I think those episodes in particular dragged the series down.

[(Anonymous)]

Bad writing loses people. *shrug*

Yes, a certain subsection of an audience will disengage from a story if they perceive the protagonist as "other" in some way, and another subsection will believe they're being open-minded and fair while actually being more critical of and disengaged from the story because they are not personally relating to the protagonist in the same way.

But even in the shitshow of the last ten years, I firmly believe that the majority of audiences will usually respond positively to well-written, well-made media.

Unfortunately, it's very easy (and has becomes increasingly easier in the age of social media) to lose focus on what should be the core aim of storytelling, which is to tell the story you want to tell as well as you can possibly tell it. It's become extremely common for creatives to end up in situations where they're trying to accomplish twenty different things with their story, and telling it as well as they can is only fifth or sixth on the list.

Casting a woman is not the problem. Casting a woman because the writer or the producer or the studio head is like, "I need to prove these airheaded Gen Z sluts are lying about me hating women," or what the fuck ever, is the problem.

[(Anonymous)]

It's become extremely common for creatives to end up in situations where they're trying to accomplish twenty different things with their story, and telling it as well as they can is only fifth or sixth on the list.

This, so much! And yes, the audience will pin it on the most visible change (e.g. a female Doctor or a Black Doctor) but it's almost always a structural problem. And sometimes a flashy new change is an attempt to paper over those structural problems. IRL, this is called the glass cliff - a failing company/political party is very likely to suddenly choose a female and/or racial minority leader.

[(Anonymous)]

"The glass cliff" Jesus I hadn't heard the term before. That's brutal, and brutally accurate.

[(Anonymous)]

If bad writing was what did it, the show's popularity should have died way before 13.

[(Anonymous)]

Also, yes, very good writing can get people to enjoy women and POC in lead roles. But when you add the stipulation that good writing isn't a requirement for people to enjoy white male leads, it really doesn't help the claim of it not being about race or gender.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, but usually the lead actors were at least enjoyable enough to get through the show.
I said it before in the comments, but I still thing Jodie Whittaker was just straight up a bad choice and they should have casted another woman. I can't even think of any previous Doctor who acted worse than a wooden spoon in the role, but it was certainly the worst that Whittaker has performed (especially when you see her in other works, she definitely can act - but in Dr Who she barely emoted past a plank of wood with an awkward smiley face on it).
Ncuti Gatwa had the perfect energy for the show and way more interesting episodes; but I think a lot of people had dropped off after Chibnall's run - as well as the fact that Gatwa's absence in a good chunk of the episodes could be felt and were really unwatchably bad. I also think there was a lot more going on behind the scenes of the shows production that might have hindered the show and with the uncertainty of when the next series would be, I don't blame Gatwa for leaving when he did.

C'mon now

[(Anonymous)]

I can't take peole seriously who call grown women 'girls' but grown men 'men'. Men and women or boys and girls, pick a theme. Calling grown women girls just shows your internalized sexism and misogyny.

Re: C'mon now

[(Anonymous)]

Hey, at least they didn't call us "females"...

Re: C'mon now

[(Anonymous)]

Ugh you've got a point

Re: C'mon now

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, it was very annoying in the recent Olympics, I thought we'd got past that! "Girls and boys" is fine. "Ladies and gentlemen" is fine (e.g. Wimbledon). "Girls and men" or "ladies and men" is not okay.

Re: C'mon now

[(Anonymous)]

Ladies and men is fine.

Re: C'mon now

[(Anonymous)]

Same, I cannot deal with that. "Girl", really? Did you refer to the previous ones as "boy" doctors? Ugh.

[(Anonymous)]

I think Jodie was a bad pick as the Doctor. Not because she's a woman, especially since I think anyone else would have been a better choice (honestly Jo Martin would have been better, but alas she only gets to be the Doctor for essentially 5 minutes. Then there's the alternative timeline where Joanna Lumley wasn't just the Doctor for a brief Children in Need sketch).
Her character was bland and uninteresting - even though I'd admit bad writing had a lot to do with it, this is probably the worst acting in Jodie Whittaker career. She just does way better in gritty dramas than whatever she was doing in Dr Who. The better part of the series that had all the character development were the companions. Also Yaz deserved way better than the Doctor.

[(Anonymous)]

Agreed 100%. No, the writing wasn't great, but a good actor can salvage a lot in spite of that and this just wasn't good acting. I think a different casting choice would have been a lot better.

This is a dumb opinion

[(Anonymous)]

It's a science fiction show. About a space alien who travels space and time, and can regenerate. They've when added regenerations in the past. The writing was the problem, not the casting of a woman or a Black man. Not in the 21st Century.

Re: This is a dumb opinion

[(Anonymous)]

Unfortunately, that's what a lot of fans blamed it on/accused people of when it was being broadcast. Some of them were so blinded by having a writer they didn't hate that people turning off from the show must have been because of some bigoted reasoning.

Re: This is a dumb opinion

[(Anonymous)]

Agreed.

[(Anonymous)]

I wouldn't call it hubris, or at least not just hubris. Somebody has to be, so might as well rip the tape off and get it over with. Maybe one day the stars will align, and we'll finally see a lasting run of diverse Doctors.