[ SECRET POST #1102 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1102 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[Dr Who starts below]











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Notes:

This isn't even all the Who secrets there are, just the ones I randomly found today.

Secrets Left to Post: 13 pages, 325 secrets from Secret Submission Post #158.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 4 - not!secrets ], [ 1 2 3 4 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's one conversation. And I don't understand why it is at all threatening to you or your own interpretation of the characters.

[(Anonymous)]

Show me a comm centered around a pairing that has these kinds of wanky posts? And this is one of many, a few still remain but most are often deleted when the racefail spirals out of control.

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

Ok- you lost me as to your argument...?

First off, every pairing on the planet has whacky ass wank. Have you BEEN to an Ianto/Jack (Torchwood) comm lately? How about the Great Spuffy Wars of 2000-something? You don't need race to get wank. All you need is someone shipping someone else.

But when you talk about racefail, are you implying that black fans are being racist by talking about Uhura/Spock in regards to race? Because that's crazypants. If you mean something else, clarify, please?

[(Anonymous)]

I'm implying fans at the comm the OP mentioned are crazy. First Uhura is not black enough, then it's onto a discussion about what makes a person black ect http://community.livejournal.com/spock_uhura/130803.html. Why so much focus on this one dimension about her when race is not supposed to speak on her character? Her substance and worth? The relationship she has with spock?

[(Anonymous)]

_{...Wasn't there some wank about her hair, too?}

That comm is like how 4chan's /u/ is always feminism discussion time, except with race.

[(Anonymous)]

yes! this is what i'm talking about. that kind of stuff is secondary to the love story that's there and people are getting all pissed about her hair, her features, the fact the actress playing her only *looks black*. and then have the nerve to tell others they are racist.

[(Anonymous)]

_{Hey, the guy who plays Sulu isn't Japanese/Filipino...}

tbph, I stopped going there when "discussion" posts that always seemed to devolve into hissing at the rival ship started to outnumber fic/art about the pairing.

[(Anonymous)]

rival ship as in k/s? slash always outweighs the het, just the way of all fandoms.

the comm has just so much butthurt, but considering who's running it, it's to be expected

[(Anonymous)]

Who else? Yeah, being a primarily het girl myself, I've accepted that fact.

_{Oh? Why the butthurt? I've been out of the loop for a while, mind sharing the details?}

[(Anonymous)]

_{regarding the mods, I mean...}

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

Are you the same anon I've been talking to? Cause I think my other comment upthread addressed this...

Uhura is the only black, female romantic lead in mainstream sci fi. THE ONLY ONE. However fans who look like her/can relate to her want to embrace her, debate her, etc etc. is really not something I want to judge.

But even if some of these conversations are wanky, uhm, so? Black fans can be as wanky as the rest of us. It doesn't take anything away from your experience.

Frankly, I don't think the stuff you're pointing to IS wanky, though. I think it's a natural result of her being the ONLY FREAKING CHARACTER OF HER KIND.

[(Anonymous)]

There's Zoe from Firefly, Selena from 28 days later, Karen from Blade. She's not the only one. And again, not black fans as you suggest, but FANS AT THIS COMM. Or are the only fans there black?

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

She is the only strong black female character who is the romantic lead of an iconic figure in sci fi. Being able to name three or ten more black women in sci fi in general doesn't counteract the fact that the number of white women in similar roles exponentially outnumbers women who are not white, and has for a long long time.

I don't frequent the comm. you linked to. I can't tell color over the internet. But the original post by the OP suggested she felt marginalized by the discussion of Uhura's race. Comments like these tend to be made by white people, who have the privilege of *not* noticing race, because we are the "default" setting for it in media.

rawles made an awesome post about why Uhura's race IS so important to black sci fi fen. I certainly couldn't say it better than that.

IF the discussion on her race is being led by other black female fans, then yeah, I think the rest of us ought to shut the hell up about it being "oppressive" in some way. There's other places to have the conversations you want to have, where race isn't included. There will always be those places, because race makes people uncomfortable, and they don't wanna talk about it. No one is saying you HAVE to talk about race. But telling people who are discussing it to shut up is not ok.

[(Anonymous)]

Being able to name three or ten more black women in sci fi in general doesn't counteract the fact that the number of white women in similar roles exponentially outnumbers women who are not white, and has for a long long time.

you asked me to name another and I did. your rules, not mine.

Unlike the OP, I can't feel marginalized by the race discussion because I am non-white but I can understand their feelings about not wanting continuous race-themed posts in a comm that is supposed to be about a ship. There are other comms for that, especially when the door doesn't swing both ways in the discussions and mods play sides.

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

I'm not making rules. I'm saying Uhura is the only character of her kind. Zoe, etc. are not leads in blockbuster movies. Nor do they get to have sex with an iconic character like Spock. There IS no other female character of color like her right now in popular media.

I don't understand the door swinging both ways comment? Her race is a big part of what makes the ship attractive to people, and I think rawles explains why very clearly.

[(Anonymous)]

28 days later was a smash and Jim was the main character. and for the 5th time, yeah, she's black but that is not ALL she is.

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

Jim of 28 Days /=/ Spock. Star Trek is a household brand, man.

And I didn't say it was ALL she is, I said it is important to a lot of people, and I don't understand how or why anyone feels like that marginalizes their own experience of the character.

It's time to agree to disagree, I feel like I've said my bit.

[(Anonymous)]

Same here. Different experiences make for different views. G'day to you.

[(Anonymous)]

I think I'm starting to understand, anon. Race does matter but when do we stop talking about it?