[ SECRET POST #1168 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1168 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

April 1st Submissions Post is open!

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 126 secrets from Secret Submission Post #167.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 - ships it ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

(frozen comment) Re: 151

[setosnicegirl.livejournal.com]

D:

I have nothing to say about this but. What the crap man?!

(frozen comment) I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

I am not a man, and this is not a "crap" (or a bingo ;)). It's my sinsere wish:) Exactly what got you so riled? You Westerners are more of a mystery to me than aliens from outer space. The Star Trek ones, at least. Is it that you have no idea about what the Japanese did in WWII - which was stuff that terrified *the Nazis* for God's sake? You may want to google "Rape of Nanking" and "Unit 731" then, and I suggest you do it fast. Like, NOW. I'll even make a start for you:

http://www.unit-731.com/index.html

Or is it the fact that some people want to turn APH into a serious movie?

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[spoggly.livejournal.com]

atomic bomb

dresden

american interment camps

katyn forest

the pogroms

chartsysk

the massacres of poland, the ukraine, belarus, the baltic states, russian ethnic "undesirables"

the battle of monte cassino

operation teardrop

hubei province

everyone involved in this war was terrible to one degree or another

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

Exactly. It is *the degree* that makes all the difference. The scale of inhuman horror, the numbers. And, of course, the question who attacked whom, and what plans the attackers had. The answers to these questions make the Allies heroic warriors, and the Axis evil near-demons - not the fact that the Allies won.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[spoggly.livejournal.com]

the idea that you are trying to argue for the heroism of the ussr. is. astounding.

the red army invaded poland with nazi germany without a formal declaration of war, and committed large-scale atrocities that would persist through the fall of the soviet union, and you're gonna sit there and blather about how you don't know much about poland?

obviously the degree matters, but your racist arguing about how A+ all the allies are is dumb as hell

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

Yeah, yeah, butthurt. I got it. I'd ask how any WWII atrocities could "persist through the fall of the soviet union", what could it mean, but I already know the answer. Been there, spoke with that. I think I'll ignore you from now on.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[spoggly.livejournal.com]

lol i am american, gurl, why the fuck do i care about your nationalism and posturing

you cannot read - "ussr atrocities" in general would extend through the fall of the soviet union, i.e. UP TO AND INCLUDING WWII

Like, you are just dumb as hell, this is amazing.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

"ussr atrocities" in general would extend through the fall of the soviet union??? :))))) Stalin and'or the USSR must be committing them out of the grave, hm? :))))))))))) You're not really American are you.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[spoggly.livejournal.com]

i'll take "berlin wall" for $500, alex

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[(Anonymous)]

how do you excuse stalin

I really want to know

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

Not at all. He does not need my excuses.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[(Anonymous)]

Because he was a mass-murdering fuckhead, right?

please say it's because he was a mass-murdering fuckhead

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

That would be a blatant lie. He was a mass-mudering genius.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[spoggly.livejournal.com]

read a book, troll harder

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[pseudo_tsuga.livejournal.com]

Yes, such a genius he caused the deaths of millions through famines-oh wait. Unless you're saying he's a genius at being a horrible human being. I can get behind that.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[angathol.livejournal.com]

Tell that to my grandfather, who was forced to hide on an Austrian sheep farm to escape the Americans and Russians in Budapest and avoid being sent off to work in Siberia for the rest of his days.

Keep on acting like the Allies are untouchable when the Russians and Americans did plenty of fucked-up shit.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

I know, I know, a real tragedy, that. There's that anecdote about two guys talking of war, an American and a German, and the German says: Listen, this is a hard subject for me, my grandfather died in the Dachau concentration camp. Oh, how did it happen, asks the American. Well, he fell from a watch tower, says the German. :)))

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[angathol.livejournal.com]

Keep on being a dickbag and feigning ignorance of your own country's atrocities.

:))))))))

BONUS: My grandfather wasn't German.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

I know about the hiwi:)

This discussion really is enlightening, to say the least. Obviously Lt. Aldo Raine has packed up his Nazi killing business too soon. If someone decided to continue it now it'd still be booming. Yes, we definitely need the serious Hetalia movie!

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[angathol.livejournal.com]

He wasn't a "hiwi." He was a conscripted Hungarian who was in the tank division fighting in Russia at one point, but managed to get a desk job out of sheer cleverness and avoid getting killed.

Please don't make assumptions about my family's history.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

This is not at all far from a hiwi. Shit. Some guy participates in the invasion of Russia, murders our people who defend their land from the Nazi scum, his actions aid the Wehrmacht in its genocidal crusade, and then this guy goes and hides among the sheep to avoid paying for his deeds. (This is what you call the Allies' atrocities? If it truly was so, then there would have been no Allies' atrocities; I can only regret it wasn't so.) What's more, his grand-child actually thinks *he* was a martyr and not the people he murdered! The anecdote was spot on, hm? You've made me sad, angathol. I think of all the racist crap here this is the worst, this idea that your granddad who murdered and helped to murder Russians had somehow become a victim because the Allies wanted him to pay for his deeds. The Allies were right, and you are as wrong as the Axis were.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[spoggly.livejournal.com]

waht is a treaty between the ussr and nazi germany

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[angathol.livejournal.com]

I'm going to preface this by saying that you probably wouldn't be so mad about this if you weren't Russian. Nobody else has judged me as harshly as you have, even people with family who fought on the Allies. This man was not related to me but he was family, so be a little kinder, stranger.

The hiwi were volunteers. My grandfather was conscripted. There is a marked difference.

The Hungarians lost badly when they invaded Russia and had to retreat. He had no "deeds" to "pay for." If it's murder to kill a Russian who is fighting in the war, how is it not murder when the Russians invaded Hungary, raping, pillaging and murdering people along the way? You're a hypocrite. You assume he "murdered" Russians, when his division lost 3/4 of their men and retreated. I could send you a .pdf detailing a brief history of what he did during the war, but it would fall upon deaf ears. Here is an excerpt regardless:

Dispatched to Soviet Union - August 20th, 1942
Stayed in camps and attacking and then withdrawing immediately after for some unknown reason. Generally advanced deeper and deeper into Russia to just beyond KHARKOV to BELGOROD - December 1942
After disastrous losses the battalion retreated to Hungary to the town of PARKANY~NANA by ESZTERGON by that time about 3/4 of the second army's 160,000 men were killed - January-February 1943

I did not call him a martyr. He had to escape from the Russians many times, who would have done worse to him than he ever did to them considering he spent most of the war either in training or in a desk job in Hungary.

I, myself, am not Hungarian. He was my step-grandfather, but he was the only grandfather I've ever known. He was a kind man, and I would not be around today if he had not survived to immigrate to England and then to Canada with my father's family. No matter what happened I will always be grateful that he survived, and that is the entire point of my story. Because if he had been killed by the Russians, I would not be here to debate this with you.

Slander him all you like, because I really don't care if I've made you "sad." You're a stranger to me, and you are being unnecessarily cruel about an individual who was very dear to me before he passed. I'm trying to explain something to you civilly and you are using emotional rhetoric to try to make me feel bad about him. Here's a tip. I'm English-Canadian by blood. My English predecessors fought in WWII, on the Allies side. I am not entirely siding with the Axis. I just understand why people did what they did, and I accept that if someone was conscripted, they had no choice in doing what they did.

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[angathol.livejournal.com]

Also, just so you know:

"The war left Hungary devastated destroying over 60% of the economy and causing huge loss of life. Many Hungarians, including women and children, were brutally raped, murdered and executed or deported for slave labour by Czechslovaks, Russian Red Army troops, Yugoslavs (mostly Serbian partisans and regular units), and the Romanian so-called "Munteanu Guard" paramilitary units — by the end of the war approximately 500,000-650,000 people."

Your head must be buried pretty far in the sand. :)

(frozen comment) Re: I protest!

[nadiayar.livejournal.com]

Now how comes that the Czechslovaks, the Yugoslavs and the Romanians don't get such questions asked? It's because this is not really about the deported Hungarians, isn't it. It's about the hate, which only uses these numbers as fuel. BTW, what exactly was the relationship between Hungary and Nazi Germany in WWII?