Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2010-03-23 04:32 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2010-03-23 04:32 pm
[ SECRET POST #1174 ]
⌈ Secret Post #1174 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
101.
__________________________________________________
102.
__________________________________________________
103.
__________________________________________________
104.
__________________________________________________
105.
__________________________________________________
106.
__________________________________________________
107.
__________________________________________________
108.
__________________________________________________
109.
__________________________________________________
110.
__________________________________________________
111.
__________________________________________________
112.
__________________________________________________
113.
__________________________________________________
114.
__________________________________________________
115.
__________________________________________________
116.
__________________________________________________
117.
__________________________________________________
118.
__________________________________________________
119.
__________________________________________________
120.
__________________________________________________
121.
__________________________________________________
122.
__________________________________________________
123.
__________________________________________________
124.
__________________________________________________
125.
__________________________________________________
126.
__________________________________________________
127.
__________________________________________________
128.
__________________________________________________
129.
__________________________________________________
130.
__________________________________________________
131.
__________________________________________________
132.
__________________________________________________
133.
__________________________________________________
134.
__________________________________________________
135.
__________________________________________________
136.
__________________________________________________
137.
__________________________________________________
138.
__________________________________________________
139.
__________________________________________________
140.
__________________________________________________
141.
__________________________________________________
142.
__________________________________________________
143.
__________________________________________________
144.
__________________________________________________
145.
__________________________________________________
146.
__________________________________________________
147.
__________________________________________________
148.
__________________________________________________
149.
__________________________________________________
150.
__________________________________________________
151.
__________________________________________________
152.
__________________________________________________
153.
__________________________________________________
154.
__________________________________________________
155.
__________________________________________________
156.
__________________________________________________
157.
Notes:
April 1st Submissions Post is open!
Secrets Left to Post: 08 pages, 185 secrets from Secret Submission Post #168.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
Re: 147
Re: 147
The real issue here is that she's made a personal choice to be fat and be okay with it. How is that anyone's business but her's? How does that have any bearing on your life or anyone else's, if she decides to take the risks that come with obesity? And those risks are just that- an increased risk, not a definite causal relationship in her specific situation. Yes, obesity has a causal relationship with health problems over POPULATIONS, but it may not, in her specific situation, have a causal relationship with bad health, based upon her specific genetics.
I guess what I'm saying is, don't be so quick to pass judgment and say it would be good if she hated herself and worked every day to lose weight. You have no way of knowing that unless you are a medical professional in charge of her care.
http://thingswithwings.dreamwidth.org/99675.html
Re: 147
As someone who has been overweight her entire life, I understand the struggle with obesity; please don't think I made my comment out of some skinny-bitchedness. As someone who has been overweight her entire life, I also stand proof as someone who is 'unhappy' with her weight and yet manages to be happy with her self at the same time.
You said: "some smokers lived to be 90, some marathon runners drop dead at 25, some fat people outlive their health-conscious peers." There are an awful</> lot of 'some's in that sentence.
I don't have a problem with the fact that that she's decided to be fat and okay with it (if, in fact, you know for a fact that she's made a comment indicating that she's happy being fat, as opposed to being happy with herself, or happy 'the way she is' which isn't the same thing). I have a problem with her presenting a lifestyle choice to the masses that is unhealthy. I have a problem with the fact that the media will rag on Mischa Barton for having cellulite, but doesn't have a word to say about her. I have a problem with models who are a size four being considered fat when they aren't.
Gabourey Sidibe, on the other hand, is and it may have a bearing on someone else's life who is going to look at her and think that it's cool that she's that size, the same way that people think smoking or drugs or anorexia is cool because celebrities do it.
And, in all honesty, if we can be upset at matchstick models for giving our young girls bad body image issues, why can't we blame incredibly overweight actresses for the same?
Re: 147
And we DO live in a society where thin is what the vast majority of people want and promote. Quite honestly, if all it takes for someone to think fat is cool and model their life after it is ONE example in a sea of examples that are a direct contradiction to that, then that person is kind of silly to start with and it's really not the example's fault. I think it's insanely unrealistic to say Gabourey Sidibe is all it's going take to make young girls want to eat a ton of McDonald's. They have so many other examples to counteract that.
And there was a lot of "some" in that sentence. That's my point- scientifically, you can only make a judgment about populations when it comes to any causal factor on average creating health problems- as obesity has been shown to be a causal factor. Within individuals, you have to look at the INDIVIDUAL factors, which, in GS's case, you can't know unless you're her doctor. Even then, I'm pretty darn certain that she knows it's unhealthy for her to be fat, as would anyone who doesn't live under a rock. Maybe she's okay with being unhealthy- that's her decision. It has no bearing on whether or not she's a good role model for other reasons (like that she's intelligent, or successful, etc.).
By your logic, every single time I step out of my house as a fat person, if I'm happy and successful and smart, I'm setting a bad example for children because I'm not unhappy with my weight, or I don't admit to wanting to change it. I think that's incredibly unrealistic and doesn't give individual people enough credit in the determination of their own lives. People have control over themselves, whatever choices they make, and to scapegoat and place all the blame on someone else (it's GS's fault, or partially her fault, that Jenny wanted to be fat, it's not Jenny's fault) that's incredibly sad and immature.
Re: 147
And I'm not talking about judging individual's for their lifestyle choices. I'm talking about judging people who know that people are looking at them; people do ridiculous things because celebrities endorse them or there would be no reason for a celebrity (vs your average spokesperson or spokesmodel) to advertise a given product. Celebrities have power to influence us and that's a simple (sad) truth of today's world.
By your logic, every single time I step out of my house as a fat person, if I'm happy and successful and smart, I'm setting a bad example for children because I'm not unhappy with my weight, or I don't admit to wanting to change it. A thousand times NO to this. That was NOT my logic and I never claimed my statement or opinion to be logical in the first place; they're merely my statements and opinions.
What I am saying is that someone who is in the public eye and is living a morally or emotionally or physically negative lifestyle (whether it be overeating, undereating, drugs, alcohol, adultery or anything else) steps out of their house and attempts to make that 'okay' to the public eye or, worse, the public eye is the one saying that it is okay -- that makes a bad impression on people looking at them and can encourage similar bad behavior.
I don't know you, but I think I can assume you aren't a celebrity, which ought to limit your scope of influence on a younger generation and therefor limit any negative impact you might (and I'm not saying you are, merely indicating that it might be a possibility) be having on people.
And I don't like definite statements. You said point blank that I said you're a bad example if you aren't unhappy with your weight. That isn't true. If you're a happy person, that's fantastic for other people to see. If you're successful in whatever it is you do with your life, that's also fantastic. Both of those things make you a good role model in those regards. But if you are overweight (and I think it should be obvious here that I'm not talking about you particularly if you're less than 40 pounds overweight or so; I'm talking about people who are morbidly obese, here), then you ARE a bad role model for healthy eating because there is no way you (or anyone) could possibly be a good role model for healthy eating if you are morbidly obese.
I mean, look: as soon as my parents starting eating in an unhealthy way, myself and the rest of my siblings started to, too. Until that point, we were all very healthy (in weight and diet) and active children. The sad truth is that there are people out there over whom celebrities have more influence than their own parents. And if we say that it's okay for GS to be that size, then at some point there will be another actress or actor that size for whom it will be okay. And then another and another. And that's when it will become a problem.
So you know what? If I have to be a perfect bitch about it? If in thirty or forty years from now when I watch TV all of the people are fifty or seventy pounds overweight? Then I can and I will blame GS and the media's reaction to her as being the turning point.
Re: 147
For funsies I'm just gonna point out the logical fallacies you're using in this argument-
http://www.onegoodmove.org/fallacy/toc.htm
The system that perpetrates the bad body image is the same thing as matchstick models.
Category Error: Division: because the whole has a certain property, it is argued that the parts have that property. (In other words, the system is not the individuals behaving in a certain way because of the system aka mistaken causality)
And if we say that it's okay for GS to be that size, then at some point there will be another actress or actor that size for whom it will be okay. And then another and another. And that's when it will become a problem.
Slippery Slope: a series of increasingly unacceptable consequences is drawn. (In other words, since we let GS be fat and accepted her, more and more and more actors will be fat. Which, if you honestly believe that's gonna happen? You haven't really been paying attention to the world.)
If in thirty or forty years from now when I watch TV all of the people are fifty or seventy pounds overweight? Then I can and I will blame GS and the media's reaction to her as being the turning point.
Post Hoc: because one thing follows another, it is held to cause the other.
I'm talking about people who are morbidly obese, here), then you ARE a bad role model for healthy eating because there is no way you (or anyone) could possibly be a good role model for healthy eating if you are morbidly obese.
Fallacy of Exclusion: evidence which would change the outcome of an inductive argument is excluded from consideration. (In other words, some people who are morbidly obese DO eat healthily, but their morbid obesity has another cause. For example- http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/02/100203131401.htm)