fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #1464 ]

⌈ Secret Post #1464 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 05 pages, 108 secrets from Secret Submission Post #209.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

"false charges" = "I am assuming that these women are lying."

Except if the charges are false then the victims are indeed lying.

that's too logical, you must be a troll

"blah blah I am a misogynist blah"

I would be glad if you explained to me how would it be possible for the rape charges to be false and for rape victims to be telling the truth at the same time?

The charges aren't false.

In any case where they're false.

What's your point? The actual rate of false accusations is absolutely miniscule (not the least because, in the American justice system at least, the process for pressing any sexual assault charges whatsoever is frequently traumatic); there's no motivation to bring them up except to cast doubt on every victim accusing someone of rape. It goes back to ASSUMING the victims are lying.

Absolutely miniscule but you're admitting they exist, then. Should those false charges be accepted without question, then?

lol what? I never said that investigations/trials should not take place.

Yes you have deemed him a rapist BEFORE a trial.

But what if the victim is lying and it is later revealed that they are lying? Then what?

Investigations/trials should take place... but if you think there's a possibility of a victim lying, you're a misogynist (according to your logic you must be, or you wouldn't think investigations and trials were necessary)?

So you're a misogynist?

If a victim accuses someone of being a rapist, I am going to assume that the victim is telling the truth and that the accused is in fact a rapist. I am not a detective and not currently a juror; the victim's word is all the evidence I require. I said no where that that should be the only standard for criminal conviction.

If an investigation or trial takes place and the accused is acquitted, but the victim continues to insist that a rape took place, than I am going to assume that yet another rapist escaped justice.

If you were a detective or a juror, or in charge of determining what happens to the accused in some other way, would your opinion or actions change?

A juror or detecitve is ideally supposed to have no bias; however, as that's unlikely to happen, I'd rather have one share my point of view than go in assuming that the accuser is lying.

Short answer: yes, because I don't agree with the state having the power to convict without evidence; I'm not a detective or a juror, so I'm not prepared to answer what level and type of evidence I'd need to either convict or acquit.

So you do admit you have bias then... hmm. For me, I'm likely to believe the accuser or at least give them 99% of my belief even if the accused is acquitted, but the fact that false accusations exist will never let me let go of the other 1% possibility. Speaking only of cases where there is no concrete evidence like a witness or a rape kit and so on, that is.

Would you call me a misogynist?

If ever a case comes along and your reaction with no or insufficient evidence is to assume the woman is lying, then yes, that's an action based in misogyny.

Is it misogyny if I would do exactly the same for a male victim?

Depends. Rape culture is in large part a product of sexism and misogyny against women. I'm my experience, negative reactions towards male victims is frequently the result of either sexism or homophobia, depending on the gender of the attacker.

Don't almost all rape cases have a witness, unless the person was drugged or very young? I mean, the major force in an investigation is always a witness. Or are you saying victim doesn't count?

I could be wrong, but I don't think they count in the legal sense, no.

They absolutely do count, and its insane that you would think otherwise. Like terrifying. Like what the fuck, even. Do you think this about all crimes, or just rapes? If I saw someone bust up my window, would I be considered a "witness" in your book? Or are rape victims the only ones who apparently cannot see for themselves?

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2011-01-06 02:26 (UTC) - Expand

just fyi, deliberate strawmanning doesn't win you arguments outside of ontd_f

[ SECRET POST #1464 ]

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