[ SECRET POST #1562 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1562 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

oh god stop using red text on jpegs

also, now affiliated with pkmnsecret! Check em out if you're interested. (:

Secrets Left to Post: 05 pages, 109 secrets from Secret Submission Post #223.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom.livejournal.com]

23. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t99/redonthefly/shipping.png?t=1301813785

[oberongeiger.livejournal.com]

Characters tend to take on lives of their own after a little while. Anybody with a proper mindset can get into the head of a well-defined character after proper exposure. That's why TV shows have multiple writers on-staff, and why comics have untold hundreds of writers over a character's career. And those individual authors will very, very frequently fail to make the interpretations gel with one another.

Hell, sometimes a creator, who is the sole author of a character, will dramatically change how a character is written, and give them a whole new trait or even make them do things that were previously 100% against who they were, just because said creator/author had a "new idea." Laurel K. Hamilton sure did it.

Or sometimes a creator known for defining specific characters will lose his or her mind and completely change everything about them, even going against their own continuity. Like Frank Miller.

So really, I feel like anybody who follows a given character is pretty entitled to say that X character won't be happy with Y character. Or that they will be eternally happy. Or that they'll be happy for a while and then it'll fall apart. Or whatever they want.

These things are just so open to interpretation after a while, because characters take on their own existence to the point that no one really gets to be more definitively correct than anybody else.

[wldcatsprstr-14.livejournal.com]

Pretty much this. Just because you wrote the character doesn't mean you can do whatever you want with it without people being like o.O when you do a character 180.

[(Anonymous)]

Do you even write original fiction? Because it sure sounds like you don't, in which case you need to STFU because you don't know what you're talking about.

If you do, I'm shocked. You are obviously a far less possessive creator than I am. I don't care if people write fanfiction about my original characters. But my canon is canon, and no fan has a say as to whether I'm writing my characters correctly or not. They're mine, as much as my children are.

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

Hell, sometimes a creator, who is the sole author of a character, will dramatically change how a character is written, and give them a whole new trait or even make them do things that were previously 100% against who they were, just because said creator/author had a "new idea." Laurel K. Hamilton sure did it.

Or sometimes a creator known for defining specific characters will lose his or her mind and completely change everything about them, even going against their own continuity. Like Frank Miller.

I think you picked the wrong selection for Hamilton. ;-)

[checkerblob.livejournal.com]

Am I the only one who finds the endless whining about shipping wars and the behavior of non-canon shippers more annoying than the actual shipping wars and the whiny behavior of non-canon shippers? Yes, crazy Harmonians are annoying, but I haven't heard from them in a while (maybe I'm just hanging out in the wrong places), and crazy OBHWFers are just as annoying. No, Ginny is not an evil whore. However, she's a fictional charcte and it's not like her (non-existent) feelings are getting hurt. If you hate the bashing because it's misogynistic I'm behind you 100%, but if you're in it simply to defend Ginny herself, because you feel like the bashing is "mean", then um, get a grip. (And for the record I ship OBHWF and like Ginny a lot.) People are allowed to critique and complain about and yes, even mock, your beloved series. It's getting to the point where you can't say a single bad thing about Harry Potter without being called a crazy Harmonian.

[(Anonymous)]

YES! I agree! I really hate discussing ship wars in the HP fandom for this exact reason.

[(Anonymous)]

Canon can be out of character. Not because the fans are arrogant, but because authors sometimes write bullshit that contradicts everything else they've said about their characters before, without any explanation, character development etc. Sometimes pairings become canon even though they make no sense, even though the writers don't even try to explain why these characters are suddenly, randomly attracted to each other. Sometimes pairings get together in canon even though it's obvious they won't work out - and that's often the case with pairings that are completely random and an obvious case of "oh, let's put character A and character B together even though they have nothing in common and so far expressed not even the mildest interest in each other".

Authors aren't infallible gods. Of course they have the right to write whatever they want in their own creation, but fans also have the right to criticise that. Just like fans can call out authors for plot holes, they can call them out for lazy characterisation, lacking character development, and pairings that came out of nowhere. Not saying that there are no butthurt fans who whine just because their pairing isn't canon. Just saying that the fact that a pairing is canon doesn't say ANYTHING about how well it is written, how much chemistry the characters have got etc.

[meadowphoenix]

Frankly I agree with oberongeiger. Creators can in fact 180, 265, replace with a changeling, their characters. However, I don't know much about doctor who, but I am fairly positive that that is not what happened with Ron, Harry, and Hermione. They stay the same with minor changes throughout the 7 books and I don't think Hermione, Ron, or Harry is ever or much OOC in canon. So yes, it annoys me when people say that they are. Ship what you like, but don't pretend that J. K. Rowling messed the characters up.

[agnes-bean.livejournal.com]

Yeah, this. In general, I definitely think it's possible that creators CAN mess up their characters, but in the case of these specific examples, I agree with the OP that they haven't.

(In terms of Doctor Who, I assume the OP is talking about people who are pissed off that Amy ended up with Rory. But she has literally only been on for a season, so it's not like there was years of canon characterization that was being changed by having her decide to be with him. Also, oh, she was engaged to him the entire series. So there's that. Having second thoughts =/= doomed to be miserable). ,

[amazing-e-ko.livejournal.com]

Yes! I think OP is bang on, mostly because I didn't get the feeling that they were making a hard and fast rule, just a general statement, which has obvious exceptions.

[alluringcliche.livejournal.com]

This. I think characters can 180 and creators can make the wrong 'endgame' choices for the characters BUT I don't think either HP or DW did this.

[mondaisenshi.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure if this is related at all or if it's just my random mind making connections that aren't there but:

OP, did you ever watch the show Roseanne? Bonus points if you know how it ended. But the end of that series seems to apply well to your closing statement...

[SPOILERS OMG!] [/SPOILERS DONE NOW]

Yeah, it's true, the mass of the fans have no idea what's actually going on inside of the characters' heads most of the time. There's no way we could: we're not psychic, the mind isn't perfect, predictable, or patterned, and moreover, they're not real and often aren't half as developed as real people. But for these same reasons, I don't think the original creators of the show, book, game, or whatever else could have a perfect insight into their own characters' minds, either. True, they often know more than the fans, but they're not infallible.

Having said that, I agree with you that people can stop bitching over it. I mean, if they want to take a minute or a day to let off steam, that's fine. And if you're one of my closest friends, then yeah, I'll listen to you complain for a lot longer than that. But I've had more good pairings destroyed by them becoming canon than by them being squashed by the canonization of a rival pair.

tl;dr: Authors don't always know better than fans, they just get the final say. And I'm fine with that.

[jlh.livejournal.com]

Aside from the canon ooc arguments, which I think are well made, I think that a canon can not write a romance particularly well, often when the canon isn't a romance canon and therefore it isn't a priority. For me, JKR didn't write romance that well. I was ready to have canon make me love the canon ships, and it didn't. (The movies have done a much better job for me in developing H/G in particular.) There are TV shows where I feel similarly (Gil/Sara hello). I think if you're going to bother to execute a romance, you should execute it well, and I don't think there's anything wrong with criticizing the execution of a romance in a canon.

[starsimpulse.livejournal.com]

haha, i thought this was going to be a comparison between the tardis trio and the hp trio, and i was going to be super excited about it. especially with the positioning of red, brown, blonde, lol.

[raequiem.livejournal.com]

...

HOLY SHIT.

That actually makes so much sense. My mind is blown.

0.0

[allstarzs.livejournal.com]

Agree so hard it hurts. I am all for shipping and think everyone should be free to ship whomever they choose, but don't get butthurt because they aren't canon, or because canon goes against your ship.

[getharion.livejournal.com]

Doc sure is looking orange there.

Sorry, just had to say it.

[mentalguru.livejournal.com]

Deathly Hallows was pretty disappointing to me. Honestly changing the ships would not have saved it even if the angst and weirdness regarding those ships also wrecked HBP for me a part form some vague redeeming features. I actually used to ship H/G before HBP yeah. But honestly I had more pressing concerns too:

I wanted Percy to do something useful damn it! Like get them Ministry info.


And for the Remus/werewolf voldy group thing to go somewhere.

And...


/slaps self

I did my whining a while back whbich was emabrrassing enough as it is, I really should control myself. lol. But yeah I kind of think people who think changing the ships of HP would have made things automatically wonderful make me go :/. I mean I don't like them either or how they turned out but there were other more pressing problems with the HP series in my view.

[mentalguru.livejournal.com]

*which
*embarrassing

I hate you dyslexia. :/

[tari-silmarwen.livejournal.com]

Yes, this.

I understand it in collaborative works like comics or TV shows, things that have multiple authors with plural interpretations of the characters and their relationships, and I understand it when the sole author/creator lapses into a bit of bad writing with character 180s and abrupt, no-foreshadowing pairing up and other such dramatic story-breaking changes.

But other that that... the writers are gonna hook up who they want to hook up and sometimes that means disappointing certain groups of shippers. What ya gonna do?

[ladyyuna07.livejournal.com]

I had to stop reading all other secrets just to tell you that I LOVE YOU ANON.

Fanwank or no, canon is canon. Go ahead and keep shipping your ships, but don't whine about how it Ruined Everything Forever.

[kaelakaelakaela.livejournal.com]

A+ A+ A+ A++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[ceruleansan.livejournal.com]

ia

There are a lot if canon pairs I don't like. I just ignore and leave alone.

[ladysugarquill]

This. So much. We should print flyers or something ¬¬