fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #1575 ]

⌈ Secret Post #1575 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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TRIGGER WARNING FOR SEXUAL/EMOTIONAL ABUSE

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TRIGGER WARNING FOR INCEST, RAPE

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 132 secrets from Secret Submission Post #225.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeats ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

WANK INCOMING

What is wanky about this?

"Male is the default"

Well, if you want to get "technical", the Bible says that Adam was created first, and in God's image, i.e. God=Man, i.e. default=man, etc...

But, yeah, I can totally see why that is wanky. :/

Depends on which version of the Genesis story you are reading but yeah

Ooh~ what other versions are there?

[/is honestly curious]

Well, there's two creation myths in the actual book of Genesis, but in both of those I think woman is made from man. There are some apocryphal creation myths (Jewish midrash, etc.) where the story is a bit different. That's where Lilith comes from, too. (Adam's first wife.) Anyway, all of my books are in storage right now, but my favorite account of the creation myth is the one where Adam is actually a [gigantic] genderless being who later gets split into man and woman.

Actually in the first version, they're made at about the same time, and neither is made from the other:

Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

(no subject)

childings.livejournal.com - 2011-04-27 01:01 (UTC) - Expand

In the initial story of creation in Genesis, man and woman were purported to have been created at the same time. This gave rise to all the awesome Lilith stuff that's been popping up ever since.

From the book of Genesis:
[1:26] Then God said, "Let us make humankind in our image, according to our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the wild animals of the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth."
[1:27] So God created humankind in his image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

ashley marquardt - 2011-04-27 02:36 (UTC) - Expand

pimpmytardis.livejournal.com - 2011-04-27 06:12 (UTC) - Expand

ashley marquardt - 2011-04-27 13:39 (UTC) - Expand

(Anonymous) - 2011-04-27 19:30 (UTC) - Expand

ashley marquardt - 2011-04-27 22:59 (UTC) - Expand

if you want to get "technical" all humans started out as female, some mutate into males at around 4 weeks.

Really? That is so cool! I totally didn't know that, thank you~

Though, to be honest, I only used "technical" (with the quotations) as the whole book has a lot of Christian imagery and symbolism in it, hence why the creation story would "technically" be men first (at least according to the Bible's I grew up with).

Does that make sense? ^_^'

sorry, on re-reading my first comment I think I came across a bit rude. I didn't mean it that way.

But yes, all embryos are female, those that have a Y chromosone cause the mother to flood her uterus with testosterone and it changes into a male within the first month.

ashley marquardt - 2011-04-27 03:45 (UTC) - Expand

getharion.livejournal.com - 2011-04-27 23:23 (UTC) - Expand

ashley marquardt - 2011-04-27 23:25 (UTC) - Expand

meadowphoenix - 2011-04-27 04:26 (UTC) - Expand

I think you have misunderstood. They say that they hope the characters are making an effort to be male, otherwise the implication is that someone who is sexless (in that context) does not need to make an effort to be male, and thus being male is the default state. It's a common idea in some feminist writings, that in the eyes of society being Female is something other than being human - that the man is human, and that the woman is human + female.

See below comment! I've seen people get jumped on for unclear wording in secrets before- while I don't intend to do any jumping, I can understand why other people would go there.

(wish I had a good "I don't mean serious business!" icon)

I feel like it's pretty clear that this secret was about how much they DISLIKED the idea of male being the 'default'...the OP prefers to assume they were consciously choosing to appear male, because otherwise it would imply that angels 'default' to being male.

I think the OP was saying they didn't like the implication that men were the default model, which is why they choose to believe Aziraphale and Crowley are making an effort to be male.

I think the wording may cause people to misinterpret it, though.

That was how I interpreted it, yes.

Re-reading it, I could see that as a possibility, and well, we'll see who else comments, but I figured since it read to me as 'COME ON PEOPLE THE DEFAULT IS OBVIOUSLY MALE' that other people would see it that way too.

I thought it was a bitter "of course, if something is the default for humanity, it's a man; I hope they are making an effort to be men." I don't think it's wanky at all, just sad.

But you appear to have zero reading comprehension, so.

fwiw, I read it the same way you did

I read it this way too.

That's how I read it, too.

Truly you are prescient, baby Draco.