[ SECRET POST #1583 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1583 ⌋


Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 83 secrets from Secret Submission Post #226.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 - too big ], [ 0 - hit/ship/spiration ], [ 0 - omgiknowthem ], [ 0 - take it to comments ], [ 0 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Comments

[mfirefly10.livejournal.com]

You just described the Doctor almost completely (except for the "Sweetie" and wife part).

First, 'Mary Sue' is a term that should be stricken from fandom because 99% of the time, it's just used as another way bash female characters. That being said, there will NEVER be a bigger 'Mary Sue' in DW than the Doctor himself.

[(Anonymous)]

...He's the main character, of course he's more awesome than anyone else.

I don't understand why, whenever an OC (which River is in this discussion) is accused of being a Mary-Sue, someone always runs in to say that the main character is a bigger Sue. The main character is meant to be special, the best thing ever just because he or she is the main character.

[curseangel.livejournal.com]

This is pretty much exactly how I feel about it. I don't get it when people say "well, the Doctor is a Sue, so you can't call anyone else a Sue!" ...except that, well, the Doctor is the main character. He doesn't get judged on the same level as the other characters by virtue of that fact alone. IDK.

[21lights.livejournal.com]

That doesn't really make sense to me. The main character is allowed to be perfect just because they're the main character? But, any supporting characters can't be perfect otherwise they're annoying and Sueish? A perfect character is still annoying no matter where they rank in terms of importance. Having said that, I don't really see the Doctor, River, or Rose as Mary Sues.

[curseangel.livejournal.com]

Personally, I think it's more "the Doctor is allowed to have some Sue-like traits because a) he is the main character, and thus needs to have certain traits in order to drive the plot, b) he is a Time Lord, whereas other discussed characters are human, and c) he has established and grown these traits over an exceptionally long amount of time." The companions and other characters, however, are on a completely different level -- they're not on the same playing field, so to speak, so I don't feel like they can or should be judged the same as the Doctor.

I also don't really feel that the Doctor is a Sue, but I do believe that River Song exhibits Sue-like traits, most of which are because of the way she was introduced into the story and how she keeps coming into it. *shrug* It's a "to each his or her own" thing, I think.

[21lights.livejournal.com]

Huh, all right. I guess I don't mind when a companion or any other character gets to be amazing too. To me, that doesn't take anything away from the Doctor. It's still about the Doctor. He's still the main character. Everyone else just comes and goes.

I was not a fan of River at first and I hated that she was coming back. But, in series 5, she grew on me and now I love her and I'm totally wrapped up in her story. I can understand people not liking her though. She's kind of like a female Jack and that type of character is a love 'em or hate 'em type.

[sophiesenoo.livejournal.com]

The main character is allowed to be perfect just because they're the main character?

No, no, only if they are men, women are always bitches Mary-Sues.

[mfirefly10.livejournal.com]

I'm not saying the Doctor can't be super special and awesome. I'm simply saying that he shouldn't get a pass simply because he's the main character. The Doctor shouldn't be praised for being clever or all-knowing while other characters are judged for those same things.

When people call River 'smug' or say that the writers wrote Rose as if she was 'a super-special snowflake' (which I strongly disagree with, btw) it's nothing compared to the way the Doctor is portrayed. This is why when any other character is called a 'Mary Sue' I need to point out that the Doctor exhibits those traits to the extreme and if we're judging in those terms, is the biggest 'Mary Sue' of them all. I don't think being the main character means those traits are more acceptable or that he should be judged with different standards than everyone around him.

[wldcatsprstr-14.livejournal.com]

Word. On all accounts lol.

[chibisaturn.livejournal.com]

First, 'Mary Sue' is a term that should be stricken from fandom because 99% of the time, it's just used as another way bash female characters.

I can't quite agree with this, but I do think that it should be used extremely sparingly when discussing canon characters. I do agree, though, that when used on canon characters it is overwhelmingly used on women who would not have been called that had they simply been male.

I'm afraid I've just read too many bad fanfic/rp character applications to dismiss the term entirely, though.

[mfirefly10.livejournal.com]

The problem is, very few people actually use it to describe characters they wish would have more flaws or be shown to fail from time to time. Most people I've seen use it in fandom do so when they simply don't like a female character.

[chibisaturn.livejournal.com]

Which is, of course, absurd. I don't even like to see it used as "this character should have more flaws/fail once in a while." I prefer to see it used as "this is not believable in this universe/this is in no way, shape, or form a person."

So, yes. Drastically overused.