[ SECRET POST #1626 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1626 ⌋


Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 53 secrets from Secret Submission Post #232.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 1 2 3 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - hit/ship/spiration ], [ 0 - omgiknowthem ], [ 1 2 - take it to comments ], [ 0 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I ather have Draco than Harry. Draco was wrong and was an asshole, but so was Harry. The only diference is that we're suppose to accept Harry because he's the hero and dislike Draco because Harry dislikes him.

[(Anonymous)]

Actually, you bring up an interesting discussion I had with my friend over how different (and possibly better) the books would've been had Harry possessed more of Draco's qualities, or at least gave into his Slytherin side more...just throwing it out there if anyone's up for discussion...

[(Anonymous)]

What do you mean?

[(Anonymous)]

da, but i'm interested in hearing your thoughts! i've never really thought about it before but the idea intrigues me

[msolomiy.livejournal.com]

screw anon, too much trouble...


Anyways, it was just this one discussion that we had and basically it got me thinking two things. One, what would the books be like if Harry was a bit more like Malfoy. Because while I enjoyed the books, I hated the epilogue. The point that I raised to my friend, was what if we had a slightly darker version of Harry who understands that sometimes sacrifices must be made for the greater good as well as that you can't really save everyone. Her comment was that if Malfoy was the main character, he probably would get Voldemort killed much quicker and that he wouldn't be quite as easily manipulated by Dumbledore. While I think she just meant it as a joke, I latched onto the whole idea, especially after I thought over the fact that Harry potentially could've been a Slytherin, but chose not to because he was fed the idea that Slytherin=evil right before the sorting. Which sort of connects to what helenadax mentioned above about kids not ever being taught that just because you're a Slytherin does not mean your evil, just as being a Hufflepuff, Ravenclaw, or a Gryffindor won't automatically make you "good"...

so, there, idk...opinions?

[(Anonymous)]

This is my main problem with Harry Potter. The kids are eleven years old and since that young age people is already telling what they'll do and who they'll be for the rest of their lives. To me Voldemort is what he is thanks to Dumbledore; that old man didn't care about the kids he just cared about doing what he thought was right and it didn't matter if an abused kid had to die fighting.

[msolomiy.livejournal.com]

quite, and both Dumbledore's and Harry's characterization raises a few questions in my mind. I mean, for one I am slightly unnerved at how fans gloss over the fact that Dumbledore expected Harry to basically perish while fighting Voldemort. Also Harry's acceptance of Dumbledore's betrayal, raises a number of questions as to what kind of a messed up guy he actually is...

[(Anonymous)]

And the part where Dumbledore keeps secrets and makes people feel guilty so they can do what he wishes. See Severus and Harry. I also have some problems accepting Harry's actions. Harry doesn't accept that people makes mistakes and that not everyone has to likes him to be a good person. Yeah, Harry was abused but I disagree with the idea that the world is black or white and grey areas are impossible. He condemned his classmates simply because some boy told him they were bad and mean at others, Harry never tried to really know them just like everybody else. If people were so worried about Voldemort why didn't someone tried to make the Snakes "see" the light?

[msolomiy.livejournal.com]

exactly! Really, I guess it's just easier to put all the blame on the Slytherins and dismiss them as evil. In fact, if you think about it, had the four houses been united during Voldemort's time in school (instead of the what seems to be the regular Slytherin vs the other three), he may not even ended up an evil overlord because in reality, you have Tom Riddle, an eleven year old orphan that while aware of his magical abilities does not really know much about the "rules" of the magical world, he is put into an 'evil' house and so really just ends up conforming to the expected behavior of a Slytherin, had there been more tolerance towards the Slytherin students instead of just labeling them evil and accepting it as a given fact, who knows what the majority of the "Dark Wizards" that were in Slytherin would've turned out like.

Also, this brings up the whole issue with Harry, choosing Gryffindor over Slytherin just because a few moments before some kid he just met told him it was where all the evil wizards went. Had the Sorting Hat not listened to him and still put him in Slytherin, what would he turn out as? Which goes back to the whole question of how much would things change had the house unity the Sorting Hat always mentions existed and where it wouldn't matter if you were a Slytherin or a Gryffindor to be considered good or evil. I think this is what probably the part in the epilogue (hate it! hate it! hate it!) with Harry assuring Albus Severus that it wouldn't matter which house he was assigned into was attempting to imply....

Gah, no wonder I love reading fanfic so much...

[silver-coins.livejournal.com]

Dumbledore wasn't the headmaster while Voldemort was in school, though. How the fuck is he the one who's fault this is? It makes no sense...

[wldcatsprstr-14.livejournal.com]

He brought Tom to the school, knowing that the kid had a troubled past and dark violent tendencies and then when Tom was sorted into Slytherin, Dumbledore didn't see fit to be a try to be a mentor to him or anything. He specifically went to the orphanage about Tom. Tom was his responsibility and he flubbed it.

[silver-coins.livejournal.com]

It's implied that he does this with all the orphaned students, though, isn't it? Tom wasn't his responsibility. And even if he was it still wouldn't be his fault. That's like blaming a killers mother for kidnapping and killing a bunch of kids; it's ridiculous. The fault lies with Tom and possibly the people who made the house-system stay in place at the time, not Dumbledore.

Also, why Albus? How about his real parents? The headmaster? The people working at the orphanage? Why are we blaming a random teacher that recruited him into the school? It just seems like you're looking terribly hard for a reason to hate him here, tbh.

[wldcatsprstr-14.livejournal.com]

It's implied that he does this with all the orphaned students, though, isn't it? Tom wasn't his responsibility.

Yes, he certainly was. The fact that Dumbledore keeps such a close eye on Harry when he first comes to Hogwarts points to the fact that Dumbledore had a similar responsibility once and he dropped the ball.

That's like blaming a killers mother for kidnapping and killing a bunch of kids; it's ridiculous.

I'd say it's more like meeting the killer at the point in time that there's a very high chance you can stop them from ever becoming that person and doing nothing to try to prevent it. Had Dumbledore tried then to take Tom under his wing or curtail his behavior, I would more easily say "OK he tried but Tom was just not having it." Then again, I don't buy into the whole "Born good, born bad" thing JK was selling in the novels so I guess that's why.

It's obvious that Tom wasn't high on his family's list of Important Things. Contemptible but having a child =/= taking that child as your responsibility, which is unfortunate. His home life was seriously fucked up but his parents never came with the intent to help him become a better person and teach him a different better world. Dumbledore is the one who brought Ton to Hogwarts. The people at the orphanage couldn't control a hostile magical child and Dumbledore came and took him. He met Tom firsthand and he knew what Tom was capable of doing, that he was capable of hurting people viciously at a very young age.

I don't hate Dumbledore. Far from it actually. But I'm not gonna ignore the fact that I think he really flubbed it when Tom was at school. I think it's a driving force behind his serious paternal feelings towards Harry. Not wanting to make the same mistake twice and all that jazz.

[silver-coins.livejournal.com]

I disagree. And I don't think I can really argue it either because we disagree on the main argument. I don't think parents, siblings, abusive boy/girl-friends etc etc are ever to blame for someone being abusive towards someone. Dumbledore might not have been the perfect teacher, but I personally find it completely unfair to say that he's to blame for Voldemort becoming a massmurdering muggle-hater. So, yeah, YMMV I guess.

[(Anonymous)]

Draco is a gigantic coward and very easily cowed by authority. If he was in Harry's shoes Voldemort would probably own the wizarding world.

Hermione probably would've gotten overconfident with specific plans and been unable to think on her feet.

Ron wouldn't have listened to other people's advice and gotten himself killed.

All the characters are flawed. Harry happened to have a great collection of flaws for a child to teen that needs to take on a gigantic evil. Harry can be stubborn, he's got a lot of anger issues, he's got abandonment issues and control issues. He's also very brave, resilient and quick thinking. If he wasn't that exact combination of characteristics, he probably wouldn't have been able to take down Voldemort at that time in his life.

While I agree the whole Slytherin/Gryffindor dichotomy is skeevy at best and JKR didn't do a great job of explicitly stating it, we saw good and bad in both houses. Slughorn wasn't evil, Draco didn't kill Dumbledore when he had the chance (haha cowardice!) we saw Dumbledore plot as well as any Slytherin, and I'm kind of annoyed with you making me argue this point because usually I'm arguing against it, because there is definitely truth to what you're saying.

Basically I you're taking the thought-process you disliked and just reversing it, and that doesn't make it any more profound or right. A slightly darker Harry would've more than likely turned into another Voldemort.

[helenadax.livejournal.com]

Yes, I remember when Draco took Neville's rememberall it was like OMG, LOOK HOW EVIL IS HE. But I work in a school and that happens nine or ten times a day. And no, these kids aren't devil's spawn.

[msolomiy.livejournal.com]

lol I did while in school daily and I'd like to think I'm not a devil's spawn XD

[gethenian.livejournal.com]

A+. Agreed 100%.