[ SECRET POST #1811 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1811 ⌋


Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 08 pages, 191 secrets from Secret Submission Post #259.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 - too big ], [ 0 - hit/ship/spiration ], [ 0 - omgiknowthem ], [ 0 - take it to comments ], [ 1 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Comments

[type89.livejournal.com]

Personal taste is personal taste. I for one have trouble finding any yaoi that doesn't fall into rape cliches and is not homophobic/misogynist. Just gonna stick to geicomi.

[(Anonymous)]

Geicomi is bara right? Do you have any recs? :)

NGL, a lot of yaoi have those... but it's not very hard to find those that don't.

[type89.livejournal.com]

No, geicomi is just comics written by gay men that focus on romance or the issues gay men face in Japan. I don't know any places that scan and translate them, just try searching geicomi scans?

[cherrycoloured.livejournal.com]

Do you have any recs for certain comics/artists?

Huh?

[(Anonymous)]

But that's exactly what bara is, "for gay men by gay men." What other definition of bara are you going by?

Re: Huh?

[type89.livejournal.com]

I always thought geicomi was focused more on relationships and romance, and general slice-of-life. Bara is huge, muscled/fat dudes fucking.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't get how yaoi is misogynist..

There's like no females in 98% of these mangas

[(Anonymous)]

You don't have to include women in the work in order to be misogynist. In many titles, the way issues like rape and abuse get handled is blatantly misogynistic. And often the pairing's dynamics are the exact same heteronormative misogynistic gender roles we see in non-yaoi works; the only difference is that both characters are male. The less-dominant male takes on the role of "woman", and gets all the usual treatment that would come with having a vagina in fiction.

And don't even get me started on the fandom. Egads.

[(Anonymous)]

Whatever you say....

[(Anonymous)]

oh lawd you lot are REALLY determined to be perpetually butthurt. I want to FedEx you some Preparation H every time the "OMFGMISOGYNY!!!!1!!!ELEVENTY!!!!" brigade comes out.

NEWSFLASH: Not every fandom has to like your favorite female characters, alrighty? Not everyone has to even like all women ever, either.

Your hemorrhoid cream is in the mail. :3

[(Anonymous)]

Wow. Maybe you need some of that Preparation-H yourself, 'cause "you have to like all women everywhere" wasn't what AYRT said at all.

[type89.livejournal.com]

Good job completely misreading their post! Unless you did not read it at all and simply saw "women" and "misogyny" and went to post a scathing and brutal burn. So brutal.

[type89.livejournal.com]

Yes, thank you, it's all this. The worst part it none of this is considered misogynistic or sexist by Japanese society and so young women will read and write these and continue reinforcing these negative ideals of relationships and sex. The exact same thing happens in shojo comics. Bara has the same issues with gender roles and rape/abuse.

It's not all Boy's Love or bara, sure, but it is an insanely high amount of the titles published. It is an actual issue that some groups study in Japan even.

[relmneiko.livejournal.com]

I always saw flipping heteronormative gender roles onto gay couple as a way to work out those issues. Things that look OK when they're playing out exactly as they always have been come out in a different light when it's two men who are supposed to be "equals".

I mean you have to consider that many BL fans are intensely concerned with considering and re-considering gender roles. That's half the reason BL exists: dissatisfaction with current gender roles and relations.

Many yaoi fangirl types go through a vagina-hating stage, but I kinda think it's necessary to get to the "I understand misogyny" stage. And people who are into BL are way more aware of it than those who only ever touched het.

[(Anonymous)]

lol, no. The most misogynistic women I have ever had the displeasure of speaking to were long-time BL/yaoi fans. It's a misogynistic genre with a fandom that cranks it up to eleven, and that's precisely why I left it.

[(Anonymous)]

For what it's worth, I agree with you. I never felt it was a purposely malicious or sinister thing, but a rather unfortunate and perhaps unconscious effect of the rigid and emotionally harmful sexism already present in Japan.
The genre would not have grown to have any variance or diversity by now if the mangaka and readership weren't actively questioning and experimenting through the work.