[ SECRET POST #1834 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1834 ⌋


Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 89 secrets from Secret Submission Post #262.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 4 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Comments

[megalomaniageek.livejournal.com]

It's this rant and comments. (http://fanficrants.livejournal.com/10827351.html)

I'm not here to stir up tons of wank and add more flames to the fire by sending a bunch of people over there; what I said was mostly just a tongue-in-cheek observation because there's a fair amount of crossover between the two comms.

Basically OP feels slighted because they messaged somebody and received no reply, assuming the recipient of the message is deliberately ignoring them. Most of the replies have been some mix of "you're not entitled to a response or any of the recipient's time and attention" and "they might not be deliberately ignoring you; there are tons of other reasons they haven't messaged you back (e.g. they forgot)." Even people who agree that ignoring is rude have agreed that OP was jumping too quickly to conclusions.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh geez. Now I'm worried that was me. I was approached by some French HP fans to translate a fic a while ago. Until the other day, I had a note on my desktop that said "Reply to French girls." But I was always of nervous about the possibilities that I never replied. I mean, I have you translate and what? You then post my fic and receive all my comments in other languages? Makes me uncomfortable.

[(Anonymous)]

most people credit the original author and link them to the post when they translate...

[megalomaniageek.livejournal.com]

I think the ranter is a sole person rather than a group, so I don't think it's actually you. If it's any consolation, most commenters would support you no matter what, and even people who think ignoring others is rude would probably still support you as long as you weren't just dismissing those girls as annoyances who weren't worth your time or notice (clearly this is not the case if you have that note on your desktop).
Even the OP admitted that it was reasonable to be uncomfortable with the request, they just wanted a reply. I don't know if your French HP fans would prefer a "no" or no response at all; the comments clearly showed that a lot of people varied on what they considered rude or not. So I wouldn't lose much sleep over it. And you can still respond saying "I've given this a lot of thought and have decided I feel uncomfortable with that" or something.
Now as the other anon said, translators typically credit the original author and link, listing themselves only as translators. The likelihood of this also goes up a lot when they've asked permission first. The OP of the rant is apparently also willing to translate all comments back to the original author so they can get the foreign-language reviews too.

But that doesn't mean you should feel obligated to do it or anything. If it makes you uncomfortable, that's pretty much the beginning and end of it, and you can say no (or nothing, and people will back that up).

[(Anonymous)]

Okay, I came out of that conversation feeling really bad for the OP, and being really pissed mad at everyone else. Clearly I am Doing It Wrong.

[(Anonymous)]

People compared getting an unsolicited email, asking permission to translate a story to sexual assault.

People compared someone seeing you reading a book on a park bench, and trying to be friendly about the book to a woman having her agency taken away.

What the actual fuck.

[megalomaniageek.livejournal.com]

Well when I used that turn of phrase, what I meant was that people are forced into a choice between loss of control over the situation or rudeness. Which I specified in the comment there. People, especially women, are considered rude stuck up bitches if they say "I don't want to talk to you" or ignore somebody. It comes down to the basic, pivotal issue: a person makes an offer and the other person wishes to reject it, but the rejection is pretty much inherently impolite. The White Elephant conundrum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_elephant#Background), as it were. My issue with the thread is that the judgment then became, "Well then it shouldn't be considered impolite."

ETA: I did think the comparison between unwanted e-mails and sexual assault was totally off-base though. Not the same thing at all.

[(Anonymous)]

Women? Everyone is rude when they ignore someone unless they have that feeling that their being creeped upon. And really, is it so hard to say "Hey, sorry, I just don't feel like talking right now, I'm really into this book"? (To use that example?) I mean, really? If the other person takes offence, that's all on them, not the person being asked, but when the person asked doesn't even acknowledge that they were asked a question... That isn't even nearly the same thing, and it's frankly insulting to have that compared to a woman actually losing agency over, say, their own bodies or other things we tend to see as "agency".

[megalomaniageek.livejournal.com]

Me: People, especially women, are considered rude if...
You: Women? Everyone is rude when...

Read harder.

Also, if you actually did read, you'd see that in every instance I've asserted that people (and remember, that means everyone, not just women) ARE being rude when they ignore somebody. What I am saying is that you are also considered rude in most cases when you say "I don't want to talk to you." I couldn't imagine a situation where I'd feel any more polite or comfortable saying that than just groaning internally and letting the other person talk endlessly to me about shit I don't care about. That's the polite thing to do, but it sucks.
Thing is, and again this is why I say things and explain things, I wasn't saying she had no agency. I'm saying she has to choose between exercising it and being rude, or not exercising it and being miserable. If rudeness is the thing in question, which it is, this is relevant. If basic survival is the thing in question, then rudeness is hopefully irrelevant (although if you read things like Gavin de Becker's "The Gift of Fear" and similar writings, it is pointed out that predators use the socialization of people - especially women - against saying no, even to unwanted advances, to their advantage).

Also, it's not that easy to draw the line between when a person is responding rationally to creepiness or being rude to somebody who just wanted to be nice. The guy in Walgreens who talked my ear off for a half hour about recovering from coke addiction sure as hell was bothering me but he seemed nice enough. I didn't think he wanted to hurt me, but then I wasn't entirely sure either.

[vicfrankenstein.livejournal.com]

You say interesting things that I've enjoyed reading.

It's set me to thinking about a couple exes who I was friends with after we broke up who suddenly cut contact (without blocking me or unfriending me on Facebook, AIM, Steam, etc...) as well as my aunt, who regularly talks to me while I'm clearly doing other shit (gaming with a headset on, for example) or just fucking stares at me... to get my attention, I think.

Much less weird that dealing with a guy who wants to chat about his coke addiction, yeah, but it's interesting to think about what would be polite and comfortable for everyone in these cases.

I could go check out the ffrants wank, but maaan I gotta go back to work and NOT punch a hole into my computer.

[(Anonymous)]

You were reading something on Fanficrants. Everyone who replied was insane (like batshit crazy) and the OP didn't realize what they were in for in posting there. Every time I go there, at first I'm laughing, then I'm wanting to punch Zachary Quinto in the face...

[dorknessrising.livejournal.com]

...Huh? What'd Zachary Quinto ever do over there?

[diorama23.livejournal.com]

All I got from that entire debacle was a complete aversion to ever posting to that community again.