[ SECRET POST #1954 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1954 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 040 secrets from Secret Submission Post #279.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

You know, fandom is all about creating safe space for people. There's warnings on fics, so readers don't accidentally stumble on non-con or bestiality or whatever the fuck. The parts of fandom I'm familiar with discourage kink shaming, slut shaming, body shaming, racism, misogyny, and any other possibly offensive problems that could arise. Yeah, there's no way to tell if someone you're interacting with in fandom is of legal age, but I can still be upset by that fact. Maybe that means I shouldn't be reading or writing porn anymore. But I gotta tell you, it sucks that, for all the allowances fandom makes to keep people comfortable, my comfort doesn't seem to matter, when it comes to not wanting to sexually interact in any way, shape or form with underage people.

[otakugal15.livejournal.com]

No it's not.

Anyone who thinks fandom is a "safe space" is really delusional.

And warnings don't do shit, especially for those who want to read what the fuck ever, whether they be 12 or older.

Be upset all you want. I just think you're getting your underwear into s twist for something you just can't fucking control and need to move on from.

You can write porn!! But stop getting all butthurt because parents don't watch their kids!!

I was lucky. My parents let me read what I wanted and explained things to me if I didn't understand something. So, should Stephen King and R.L. Stein be held accountable for a 11 year old reading adult rated/rather explicit lit? Hmm?

Authors know that any and all ages will be reading their books/fic/comics/etc. And they can be disapproving all they want. I just find it a very useless thing to be upset over.

[nyxelestia.livejournal.com]

Anyone who thinks fandom is a "safe space" is really delusional.

THANK YOU!

I get so sick of hearing people go all "fandom is a safe place!" when it rarely really is. D:

[(Anonymous)]

Man, you really are a dick. You're self important and entitled and flat out rude. No matter what your actual age is, you might as well be a child.

[otakugal15.livejournal.com]

*yawn*

And this makes me feel ~oh so baaaaaaad.

I don't give a shit, nonny. Go pester someone else now.

[cleverthylacine]

Well, my comfort doesn't seem to matter to those who view reading and writing fic as a sexual interaction between me and them. I don't want to have a sexual interaction with you! I just want to post my fic and read other people's fic. I do not want you thinking of me as your sexual partner in some weird way because you read something I wrote or wrote something you read, and I wish that people who insist on viewing it that way would stay far away from me, because that's gross. And I am over 40.

I'd much rather a 12 year old was reading my fic than you, if this is how you view reading fic.

[(Anonymous)]

I've seen you mention this a few places in this thread and you really don't get it, do you? It's not about how you view reading and writing fic or other fan things. Maybe to you, fic is like published work, you put it out there, you can't control who reads it or what they chose to do with it, and that's that. But some people see fandom as an interactive experience- some fan things, like RPing, are interactive- and, whether you like it or not, it's possible they could see sharing work or participating in a dialogue with a minor as a sexual interaction. I know it's weird and gross, and that's the point. If lawmakers or law enforcement choose to see it that way, it could mean possible legal action. This makes me uncomfortable, and I don't appreciate feeling uncomfortable about one of my hobbies, just so some 12 year can read porn.

[cleverthylacine]

RP is different from fic. I don't view RP as a personal sexual interaction, but I can understand how someone would. With RP you run the danger that someone reading the chat logs may think you are engaging in cybersex with the intention of getting each other off or even eventually moving into personalised cybersex.

I am one of those people who would be skeeved out beyond belief if I found out someone thought of RPing with me as having sex with me rather than writing a story together, or me getting them off, rather than writing a story together, particularly given the amount of time I spend on characterisation.

But I've had the experience of finding out that I was RPing with someone underage--and had been for quite some time--and it was a total freakout. Who wouldn't be concerned about at least the legalities there?

However, I think it's weird and gross to view reading someone else's story or talking about that story, even with them, as a personal sexual interaction. I have no comprehension whatsoever about how somebody reading your fic and leaving a normal comment (not a gross one like "I fapped to this and it was AWESOME" but rather something like "Wow, I never thought I could believe in a story where Tavros dominates anyone, but somehow you managed to do it and stay IC, good job!") is a sexual interaction between you and them.

Fic IS published work. Once it's out there, you have absolutely no control over who reads it and what they choose to do with it. If you want to know about and control who reads your stuff, you need to lock it in your journal, because strangers are under no obligation to tell you who they are before they read things that are publicly posted on the internet or use whatever methods of communication are available to them to communicate their thoughts to you.

I totally get that there are people who still feel that these are personal sexual interactions. But what I don't get is how they think they can wish these very basic facts about the nature of public internet posts out of existence. It doesn't matter how you feel, if you don't lock your stuff up where you have control over who sees it, any stranger with an AO3 account or whatever can read it.

Also, I have little sympathy for this point of view, because at least you can age-rate your shit and tell yourself that nobody underage is reading. Unfortunately I have NO WAY to protect my personal boundaries around dealing with people who think this way. I don't want to have sexual interactions with strangers but there's no way to code a filter or rating for that and I have no control over whether people who do feel that way leave gross comments about what they did after they read it. I put up with it, because it's the nature of the internet and my choice is to accept it or not post. That is the same choice you have, except I don't get to click a rating button and lie to myself about having another option.

What bothers me the most is that the people who claim to feel that way are often all over the anonymous kink memes. If you view exchanging stories as a personal sexual interaction, why the fuck are you doing it in a public forum that is deliberately anonymous and then bitching because you might be doing it with someone underage and not know? If you went into a public bathroom and knelt in front of a glory hole, there'd be nothing stopping a 16 year old from sticking his dick through. If it's a personal sexual interaction and you choose to have personal sexual interactions with complete strangers, then you have to accept the risks of that behaviour. I get that anonmemes are satisfying in that you get to ask for stuff you want to read and people write it--and that you don't have to admit to what you want or admit that you are willing to write X thing. But when I fill prompts it's because the idea of the character doing this thing has inspired me, not because I want to get a stranger off, and it's about the characters and the story, not me.

I wouldn't have anonymous sex with strangers and if I thought of writing as sex...

[otakugal15.livejournal.com]

All of this.

Yes, I can understand the RP side of things (i just never mentioned that as i focusing on fic, though i know of friends who RP'd sex scenes when they were under 18), but people getting skeeved out over the reading of fic is what's making me side eye the majority of people here.

As I mentioned before, should authors like Stephen King, R.L.Stein, Thomas Harris, etc be held accountable and be viewed as sex offenders because a 11-13 year old me just HAPPENED to be reading their books at the time? That's absurd, isn't it?

It's the same with fanfic writers. It gets published, it's out there for public consumption, unless you're THAT weirded out by strangers reading your fic that you f-lock it for only you and your friends (and said friends can range in age on an LJ f-list unless you've REALLY done some leg work to ONLY include school/actual IRL close friends). In which case.....why post it? Why not just send a copy to a friend to look over and that's that?

Makes no lick of sense to me.

[cleverthylacine]

Dude, the person who recommended Kushiel's Dart to me was a 15 year old. Need I say more? :) Bit of a shock when I actually read it and discovered how racy it is.

[otakugal15.livejournal.com]

Hahahaha. I was recced quite a few fics like that when I was younger and even now. Heck, I stumbled across one hell of an epic Sesshoumaru/Kagome fanfic, after finding it recced a few times on Deviantart of all places, when I was in mid-high school that had GREAT sex scenes at the end. XD And I am pretty certain the author of that fic was a college age student at that point.

I wouldn't hold any of those people accountable, then or now.