[ SECRET POST #2007 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2007 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 111 secrets from Secret Submission Post #287.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ], [ 1 - text secret ], [ 1 - empty image ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[stainless]

I am pro-choice, but I totally understand you. I was pro-life for a long time when I was younger and it used to drive me crazy that people would assume that had to do with men or with religion. Actually it had to do with having a disability and with being born prematurely. The preemie thing made me uncomfortable with the idea that you're a baby if you're out and a fetus if you're in -- I just happened to become a person quickly? It didn't make sense to me. And disability made me really leery of some people's reasons for aborting (and still does.) I ultimately decided that making abortion illegal would hurts more than it would help, but I still feel really strange sometimes when I hear people talk about "lumps of cells" or "on demand and without apology!" and sneering at people who find the whole thing more complicated.

So... I hope this doesn't begin any wank. but let me just say I disagree with you but don't think that means there's something wrong with you or horrible about you. For whatever it's worth. :-)

[diet_poison]

I actually also kind of dropped the "I think abortion should be completely illegal!" tack a while ago...probably because I realized it wouldn't do much good.

But I don't think abortion is okay, except where the mother is in danger blah blah etc. I would rather see a change in our culture where we truly value all human life and seek to preserve and cherish it, than a law eliminating abortion across the board. I want to see an overhaul in our adoption and foster care systems, more assistance to women who find themselves with an unwanted pregnancy, better sex ed, etc. That kind of thing. But it doesn't feel right to call myself pro-choice because I do value the unborn as humans with the right to life and I don't condone elective abortion in any way.

[stainless]

Makes sense to me. I think a lot of pro-choice people would call you pro-choice, actually; they see "pro-life" as meaning "holding the view that abortion should be illegal." I understand the desire for simplicity there, but I don't think it really does justice to feelings like yours, where it's "well, I don't want to criminalize it but I still feel that it's wrong."

[diet_poison]

In a perfect world it would be illegal, just like the destruction of human life is generally illegal and people are protected that way. But in a perfect world, people wouldn't disagree on what a human life *is* and the reality is that people do. I'd rather put my energy into making situations as good (or less bad?) as possible for women and children and protecting what I believe to be human life, than put my energy into creating situations where those who are desperate put themselves in even more danger. btw, I would really love to see a world where women don't feel like abortion is their only choice, where they're desperate because their family will disown them, abusive partner will abuse them more, they'll never be able to finish their education, etc. That's a daunting task, but the stigma placed on pregnant women and the lack of resources available to help them is at the root of not only this but so many other problems.

Glad we have so much common ground :)

[stainless]

You're making sense to me! I think I'm a little more forgiving of abortion than you are. I still really don't like it and it deeply concerns me that people try to minimize the seriousness of taking human life. But for me it's less "we don't live in an ideal world" and more that I feel that while deciding whether to abort is a moral dilemma (and it bothers me greatly that some people seem to feel it isn't), it's not one I think I get to intrude in.

Honestly, if I were pregnant (somehow -- I thank my lucky stars near-daily I'm gay so I don't have to worry about this), I don't know what I'd do. The very thought of being pregnant deeply revolts me and I can't imagine trying to live through nine months of horrified disgust at my own body. But could I take life to ease my distress? I don't think so. But even after every day of my life being what for me would be an experience of profound body-horror, there would then be a child, whose fate I'd either be the closest part of or at least have to decide. Could I do that? I don't know.

I don't think I could bring myself to do what I do, yes, see as killing to avoid all that. But I do think that whether I did it or not, I'd probably end up with crippling, and possibly suicidal, depression. (Which would not do much for the life I'd be deciding whether to spare...) Since I think that being in that situation would be something so deeply horrifying that I have no idea how I'd handle it, I can't promise I know whether I'd abort or not. And if I am sure only that I have no idea how I'd deal with it (or if any solution I came to would be sane enough to actually count as dealing with it), I feel I can't in good conscience want to take others' choice away or condemn them for making it.

So that's why my feelings are what they are. I consider myself pro-choice, but pretty much horrified by the whole thing. It saddens me that so much of the pro-choice movement in the US is so focused on trying to make it seem like the whole thing isn't a horrifying moral dilemma. For some of us it really is.

I stand by my opinion and I'm proud of my convictions, but I really wish more people would respect that I came to them by wrestling with what to me is a really seriously morally weighty issue and as I see it, there's really nothing "good" on either side.

[diet_poison]

I'm glad you and I are able to find so much common ground on this issue, and I deeply respect the amount of thought and consideration you've obviously put into it. Many people on both sides of the issue don't think about it nearly that much.

[diet_poison]

I guess I'm not comfortable referring to myself as "pro-choice" because of the connotation it carries: that it is okay to kill a human being. But I definitely see where you are coming from, there.