fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2016 ]

[ SECRET POST #2016 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2016 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 065 secrets from Secret Submission Post #288.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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I always wonder how people expect Merida to act when she doesn't feel ready to get married. To be fair, she doesn't really tell Elinor this - and even though we don't get a ton of backstory, the snippets we do see in the beginning show that Merida doesn't quite have the will, enthusiasm, or even talent for royal duties and expectations. & I'm not even sure why the queen changes her mind halfway through to let Merida follow her own destiny. Gratitude for her daughter not leaving her a bear?

It's just - argh, the narrative...

The queen changes her mind because by that point she's seen that Merida's chosen lifestyle makes her happy, and that she has a lot of virtues even though they don't directly relate to being a queen. The scene by the river is a big part of it, I believe. As a mother she wants Merida to be happy. I'm not really sure why people clutch to the 'but it's tradition!!' argument so much-- traditions change. Or in this case adapted because at the end they don't completely discard the marriage, just postpone it for the happiness of everyone involved (remember even the princes ended up siding with Merida when she said they should be free to chose who they liked)

I also think that Merida does have the talent to be a good queen-- she did learn the history lessons her mother taught her and applied them when it was needed. She's just maturing slower than Elinor.

Just IMHO, but I felt like the whole point was that they showed they actually DID listen to each other? Merida stepped up and calmed down the warring clans by telling the old story Elinor used to tell her ... And Elinor realized Merida had listened to her and taken what she said to heart, so maybe she should consider Merida's feelings about not being ready for marriage instead of just blindly forcing it upon her just because.

If that even makes sense, Idk.

No, that makes a lot of sense. The importance of listening was what I took away from the movie. I don't really understand why people don't see that.

I always wonder how people expect Merida to act when she doesn't feel ready to get married

Plus, they told her LITERALLY at the last minute. Imagine if your parents just one day up and went, "Oh, by the way, three [members of the opposite sex] who you've never met before are showing up tomorrow (or soon, anyway), and you're going to marry one of them".
Yeah, I'm sure you'd be THRILLED.

Well, duh. We wouldn't be thrilled because that's not how things are done anymore. But given that being married off is the norm in their society and most women have to go through that, it shouldn't have been as much of a surprise to Merida as it was portrayed. It's weird that Merida who would have seen arranged marriages all around her from childhood was floored by the fact that she has suitors and that the time has come for her to marry. She's too much of a modern teenager for the setting and it makes her appear more of a brat.

Yeah, that's one of my main issues with these kind of "rebel princess" type of protagonists. They usually write a modern teenager in an ancient setting.

Yeah. I enjoy rebel princesses a lot actually, but I also feel the disconnect you're talking about sometimes. And yeah, it takes me out of it a little. If Merida had been shown knowing about it all along and just being in deep denial until WHOOPS THAT'S TODAY, FML! it would have been less jarring to me too.

Yeah. It didn't make sense that Elinor was preparing her to be a lady but NEVER mentioned that she may have to be married off.

If Merida had been shown knowing about it all along and just being in deep denial until WHOOPS THAT'S TODAY, FML! it would have been less jarring to me too.

Anon who started the sub-thread and I agree completely. And it was kind of jarring that she (and some movie-goers) reacted like she was to be wed right away, while I had the impression that she only had to choose from the suitors and the wedding would be some time in the future, so if she had chosen her future husband she would have had time to get to know him.

Yeah. As I said to my brother after the movie, it felt like they couldn't decide if they were doing a period piece or a modern allegory. And one of my most hated fictional tropes is the one character that has magically modern attitudes in a world where there's no place for them to have learned it.

magically modern attitudes in a world where there's no place for them to have learned it.

Yeah, I'm not so fond of this either. There's a scene where the dudes say "hey why can't we just all BE INDIVIDUALS AND DO WHAT WE WANT" or something like this HUGE AMAZING REVELATION AND THEY ALL LIVED HAPPILY EVER AFTER, and I'm like UGHHHH like I'm getting AMERIKAH=FREEDOM shoved down my throat. The worst, most rah-rah shallow interpretation of individualism ever.

But I digress. It's just a Disney movie, and it was fun. Even if it was not a good analysis of power and duty.

It's an American movie by an American corporation. Yes, it's going to be infused with American ideals. Don't watch if you don't like it.

I'm so sick of anti-Americanism by people who are watching American media. Read the damn label next time.

Oh dear, LOL, did you miss the bit where I said "It's just a Disney movie". That kind of mental sleight of hand is necessary when watching US pop culture, it almost doesn't bear mentioning, except maybe to patriotic anons.

I'm so sick of anti-Americanism by people who are watching American media. Read the damn label next time.

So, by implication, Americanism includes warping the facts of history to support the ideals we liked to believe we embody even at the expense of realism?

...actually, that sounds about right, nm.

It's not anti-America to be annoyed that a show where the PLOT, STORY and CHARACTERS are NOT AMERICAN go off and ACT AMERICAN. It doesn't make sense, THEY'RE NOT IN AMERICA.

I was expecting a crying eagle and everything, considering eagles don't cry.

Because watching an American movie means you MUST support American ideals or else you are bad and wrong and anti-American nationalism!!!!1 Not just that, you know, you're voicing your displeasure with it. Because ~IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING NICE TO SAY (about America), DON'T SAY ANYTHING AT ALL~. (Or, really, "if you don't have anything nice to say, then stfu and get out of the country if you don't like it!!!!1".)

Also, it REALLY bothers me when people say things like, "DON'T WATCH IT IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT". How the fuck do I knew whether or not I like it until I've watched it? WAT? Do you guys seriously just not bother to think these things through before you say them?

Because young teenagers always do what society expects of them.

Yes, that's exactly what I said. It's surprising that Merida didn't do what her society expected her to do, not that she apparently didn't know what would be expected from her, given that she would have been exposed to it all her life. Thank you for reading my comment and getting it.

haven't seen the movie, but isn't it set in like a medieval-ish society? I think she should have expected it. I'm not saying she should have to agree, but if that's what is customary, then it should be no surprise.

Wasn't if the father's fault that she didn't know? He was supposed to tell Merida and totally dropped the ball, and Elinor was pretty unhappy about it if I remember correctly. They were around the dinner table at the time.

Yeah, her mother was trying to raise her as a princess but her father was fine with letting her have a bow and and praising her escapade up the falls and making fun of the suitors with her. I got the impression he'd raised her like he'd raise a son so she'd gotten the impression she could skirt the princess rules, that they didn't apply or at least shouldn't.

Oh I meant specifically about the marriage and the dad forgetting to tell her prior to it. Hence why it was dropped on her so suddenly.

I definitely saw that as Merida hadn't been paying attention to her mother at all and so wasn't aware that Elinor had arranged for her to choose between the three clans. Merida did know that she got to choose the decisive event, so she WAS to some extent aware that these things happen. She just didn't pay any attention.

Merida did know that she got to choose the decisive event

No, she found out when it was mentioned the day OF the event.
Nothing in the movie says or even suggests she knew any of this was going to happen until she was told in the scene at the table.

Edited 2012-07-11 03:21 (UTC)

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[ SECRET POST #2016 ]

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