[ SECRET POST #2080 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2080 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 034 secrets from Secret Submission Post #297.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 4 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 2 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[ladyknightanka]

YES.

YES, THANK YOU, OP.

I really like Loki, but as he is - he's a villain, yes, but one with sympathetic motivations. But I feel like admitting you like him means people immediately judge you as a woobie!Loki loving apologist who has self-insert fantasies about dating Hiddles, WHICH IS NOT THE CASE. I've seen so much weird attitudes on either extreme - from the above, to the bitter, bitter people who hate this character and judge everyone who likes him. It's nice to know that there are people who fall into neutral territory. *clings*

[(Anonymous)]

sympathetic motivations?
like really?
Killing people, destroying new york etc...

[ladyknightanka]

Oh, don't get me wrong - I don't mean that his motivations (which aren't 100% sympathetic, but also not 0%, in my opinion) excuse his actions. Nothing excuses attempting the genocide of innocent (or any) people. I just mean, like the OP said, he wasn't evil for only the sake of being evil. With the context of Thor, I feel bad for him, but even if I don't excuse him for his actions in Avengers, I DO think he's an interesting character and, if it can be done well, I'd like to see a redemption plot. Even if they DON'T go that route, I'll keep watching.

You don't have to like him. I'm okay with people not liking him. I don't like people thinking everyone who does like him is in the extreme that believes he's perfect and the victim, etc, etc, etc, because I don't. I just like him and sometimes find him sympathetic. *shrug*

[(Anonymous)]

oh okay now I got it

[ladyknightanka]

:)

[(Anonymous)]

I LOVE THE IDEA OF LOKI IMPREGNATED BY THOR'S MIGHTY HAMMERS, GOING THOUGH HOURS OF EXCRUCIATING LABOR FOR A NATURAL ANAL BIRTH, AND THE AVENGERS CHEERING HIM ON, ""WHO'S THE MEWLING QUIM NOW!!!???"

[ladyknightanka]

Ya know, I'd totally read that. ;D

[(Anonymous)]

There's a difference between actions and motivations, anon. Loki's motivations are sympathetic. The choices he makes, and the action he takes, because of those motivations (the things you listed) are not.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think all of his motivations are sympathetic

[(Anonymous)]

And I don't think that any of them are sympathetic. He tried to commit genocide because he hated an entire race, got his brother kicked out of their world because he was jealous of him, attacked earth because...uh...because he wanted power, maybe? ...jealousy and hatred are not motivations I empathize with.

Loki's a petty little bitch.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, those would be pretty awful motivations -- IF they had anything to do with what Loki did. Fortunately, Loki's actual motivations look rather different.

He tried to commit genocide because he'd been raised to believe that the Jotunn were Always Chaotic Evil monsters and he wanted desperately to prove that he wasn't on their side after discovering that he actually was one.

He got his brother kicked out of their world because he knew that his brother was an arrogant, impulsive, violent ass who would be a terrible king, and he was jealous of him -- because he was the overlooked second son.

He attacked Earth for two reasons. He wanted desperately to prove to himself that he was a worthy prince and ruler, and he was coerced by some very powerful and dangerous aliens who saw a use for him.

You don't actually have the slightest idea what Loki's actual motivations were. You even admit that when you talk about the attack on earth.

You may not sympathize with ~jealousy and hatred~, but insecurity and fear are motivations that a lot of people find sympathetic. You just have to be paying at least a little bit of attention to the actual movies.

[(Anonymous)]

nayrt

Er, maybe I'm wrong, but the Chitauri didn't seem all that dangerous or powerful compared to Loki? They were pretty much just humanoids with futuristic weaponry. He was in command of them, and the Other stated outright he was their leader. I thought they were threatening to tell Thanos (who IS dangerous and powerful) on him if he didn't do a good job of conquering the planet.

[(Anonymous)]

Someones been playing in fandom for too long. You're stretching so far that you're gonna pull something.

[dazzledfirestar]

Let's go over some of your conjecture here. Most of this is fanon. Not canon. Sorry.

he wanted desperately to prove that he wasn't on their side after discovering that he actually was one.

No. He was trying to prove he was more worthy of the throne than Thor was. That was his stated reason. He wanted to be equal to (or greater than) Thor. You're projecting your own reading onto that one.

because he was the overlooked second son.

We have no canon evidence (aside from Loki's "I'm so ignored/you threw me off the bridge" delusion speech to say that he was overlooked in any significant way. At the very least, Thor and Frigga's reactions to him in canon are pretty loving and supportive.

he was coerced by some very powerful and dangerous aliens who saw a use for him.

There is nothing in canon that states that. At all. Thanos is a threat but there is no actual evidence that Loki was "coerced" by anyone.

I am not a huge Loki fan, but I do understand where the sympathetic aspects of his story are. They are there. In canon. There is no need to bring your fanon into it.

[intrigueing]

*cough* Um, right, lets try to not undermine the OP's very good and reasonable secret by bringing in all kinds of baseless fanon and making people who think Loki can be both evil and sympathetic look like they're stretching to twist all his motivations into something they're not, okay? You're not helping the OP's argument if you start ignoring Loki's real, existing sympathetic traits for ones that Loki-bashers can easily pounce on as being totally made up.

[ladyknightanka]

Yup, +1.

[(Anonymous)]

2/10

[(Anonymous)]

THIS. I hate that this fandom likes to jump to conclusions so much, probably it's so they can feel superior about themselves?

[(Anonymous)]

Mostly I just want people to shut the fuck about him. It's nothing to do with you guys, fan away, but I'd love to have the Avengers fandom separated from the Loki fandom. Loki's in EVERYTHING. It gets tiring, you know? Like...idk, your least favorite kink occurring in every damn prompt on a kink meme (happened to me once. DAMN YOU BESTIALITY, U SO NOT SEXY).

[ladyknightanka]

I understand. That would annoy me, too.

Maybe we're hanging out in different parts of fandom, though? For context: I'm a multi-shipping, multi-character lover. Although Thor/Loki and permutations of Steve/Tony/Bruce are my favorite pairings, I like most combinations of the fandom's ships - Tony/Pepper, Steve/Peggy, Natasha/Clint, Clint/Coulson, Loki/Tony, Natasha/Pepper, and so on. Pretty much anything.

And...I don't feel drowned in Loki? I mean, there's a lot of Loki on Norse kink, but not as much in the general Avengers comm, or in the fandom in general, in my experience. I see lots of stuff for lots of combinations of characters, and as someone who likes all these characters/pairings, I come away sated.

I'm sorry your experience hasn't been as pleasing. :(

[(Anonymous)]

I was in Norsekink before Avengers came out, and now every mention of him is like nails on a chalk board. Heh, I hadn't considered that it could be my Norsekink experiences. Because, yeah, holy fuck, Loki gave birth to half the world on that kink meme, and fucked the other half.

Might have to give it another look. Maybe it's balanced out in the last few months.

[ladyknightanka]

I think Norse kink is pretty much the Loki prompts place, though there are other Thor (2011) related prompts/fills, too. I recommend you avoid it and try Avengers kink. It's also very active, but has focus on other characters. :)

[dazzledfirestar]

I'm sending you an internet fist bump right now. I've really had it with the Loki floods too.

Luckily, I've found it pretty easy to just duck and cover and avoid most anything Loki-centric. That seems to be the plus of all my favs being SHIELD agents. It sucks though, I would think, if you really love Thor and don't want to wade through Loki-centric stuff.