fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2137 ]

[ SECRET POST #2137 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2137 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 015 secrets from Secret Submission Post #305.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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Well, I'm only about 2/3 of the way through the first book (I'm reading it extremely slowly, because I'm liveblogging/snarking as I go), and so far the most obvious one is that he stalked her back to her house after she sent him an email saying, in essence, "I don't want to get into BDSM, goodbye" (it was a joke, but he didn't know that at the time). He then trapped her in her room and had sex with her. While she was saying "No!" and trying to kick him off. I actually triggered myself snarking that one, because it was pretty close to the bone.

But he's also had kinky sex with her without her agreeing to safewords, and pressured her into kinks she's said she's not comfortable with, and felt her up while they're sitting at the dinner table with his parents and she's clearly uncomfortable with it, and told her that if she doesn't have sex with him his way he'll dump her, and basically every kind of rape/dub-con you can think of that Todd Akin wouldn't think was legitimate.

(my topical humour is a bit out of date)

He then trapped her in her room and had sex with her. While she was saying "No!" and trying to kick him off.

Oh HELL NO. My God, this is sickening. Thanks for the info (and for giving me more legitimate reasons to judge the next person that tells me they want their own Christian Grey). Ugh.

(Same anon - replying on an RP account because they're the only DW accounts I have. Keep forgetting F!S isn't on LJ any more.)

Yeah... there was some bullshit reason she was saying no and trying to kick him off (iirc, it was that he was taking off her socks and she was scared her feet smelt), and so it's all passed off as ~but I wanted it really~, and I was just like UM DUDE NO HE LITERALLY STALKED YOU TO YOUR HOUSE (having already stalked her by tracked her cell phone. after one conversation outside of work. Just adding that) AND GOT BETWEEN YOU AND THE DOOR AND TIED YOU TO THE BED AND HAD SEX WITH YOU WHILE YOU WERE SAYING NO AND TRYING TO KICK HIM OFF. Like. It's like the ultimate in rape apologism, because it's from her POV and of course she always ends up enjoying it, so it's surprisingly easy to forget that he has no way to know she's not enjoying it.

It's what really disturbs me about the book, even more than how it keeps presenting BDSM as a mental disorder or a symptom of trauma (even going so far as to say that the woman who introduced him to BDSM "ruined him") - it is constantly, even more than most terrible porn, glorifying rape and abuse.

Gonna plug myself a bit here, but if you want to pick up on the sense of it without actually reading it (and, honestly, 300-odd pages in I can just about feel my brain leaking out of my ears) my liveblogging-50-shades tumblr is here. (That's basically just quotes+commentary, plus there's summaries of each chapter)

... Is that a Sandman muse I see? *A*

I answer your question with one of my own: IS THAT AN EIGHTH DOCTOR?

(Yeah, I played Hob briefly. It was fun, but the game died, so... I was far too tempted to make these responses IC)

Yes! Yes, it is! ♥ Yay, someone else who knows Eight~

(Aw, that's too bad about your game. But yay for a Hob muse, nonetheless? |D)

Proud Whovian, right here. I didn't like the film much (it was okay, but it didn't feel very Who and Grace was so resoundingly unprofessional all the time that it really bugged me) but Paul McGann's Doctor was amazing. Plus he totally had the best fashion sense of all the Doctors. He's my fourth-favourite Doctor (Yes, I am the kind of Whovian who ranks them in order. Nine and One are tied for the top spot)

That geekery aside... yes, it's a shame the game died. It was a continuation of a long-running LJ game (roleplayedingly), and I modded it, so it felt kind of like a personal failure that it collapsed so quickly. :( I haven't played Hob since, just because I haven't had anywhere to.

/end unnecessarily long and nerdy response

The film was pretty terrible, ngl. Paul McGann ~~and Daphne Ashbrooks' corset~~ was pretty much the only good thing about it. But he did his best with what he was given, and his audio dramas are excellent. Some of his books are amazing, as well. And yes, Eight was totally the best-dressed. (As far as Classic Who goes, I'm up to Three, and I love them all, so far. *A*)

Oh, I'm sorry to hear that. I've tried modding a few times, but it never worked out very well. I've always been much more comfortable as a player. But if it helps, sometimes games just go poof. It sucks, but it isn't necessarily anybody's fault. But there are lots of nice games on DW, if you ever feel like checking them out~

/totally necessary |D

I think the film was just a really failed attempt to Americanise what is about the most British show ever. Because Who doesn't work when it's epic and big-budget (and I do seriously think it's lost something with the advent of CGI), and it doesn't work when it goes Hollywood. But Paul McGann was excellent, he really was. And one day, I shall cosplay Eight.

...actually, one day I would like to get a group together and cosplay all eleven Doctors. THIS IS A THING WHICH MUST HAPPEN.

I've modded a couple of more successful games as well (or at least longer-lasting ones), but it always feels that bit worse when they die. But I mostly RP single-fandom games on IJ now, and I have yet to find any of those where Hob would fit. :p

Yeah, I agree. Doctor Who is, imo, best left to its own devices. It can be perfectly charming on its own, and whenever it goes for bigger budgets, as much as I enjoy the enhanced effects/sets/costumes/etc., something in the writing tends to come off as trying too hard. And yay! Eight cosplay! :D

DO IT, DO IT, DO IT. ♥

Yeah, that's understandable. And it's a shame, but single-fandom days seem to be losing steam these days. :(

I no longer have the old!Who response of OH MY GOD I WANT TO WORK FOR THE BBC PROPS DEPARTMENT, either... But yeah, increasingly it seems to be about BIGGER STAKES! BIGGER MONSTERS! MORE THINGS GOING BOOM! I am becoming very disillusioned with Moffat's Who, although Doctor's Wife and A Town Called Mercy were both excellent. Oddly enough, those were noticeably the simpler ones, effects-wise...

I would, but first I have to find ten more cosplayers and an event to use as an excuse. Soooo...

(How the hell did we get to this conversation from Fifty Shades of Fail?)

XDDD I know, right? Things going boom can be fun, but not when the writing fails to hold up. And... I definitely agree. I loved s5, it was my favorite, but s6 was such a letdown that I was basically done with s6 by the mid-series finale. s7 isn't as horrible as s6, thankfully, but it's still been pretty "meh" for me. imo, TDW was easily the best episode of s6. I did really enjoy ATCM, though, especially since it took a look at the Doctor's dark side.

Aw. Good luck, though!

(ilu? |D I don't even know.)

Angels Take Manhattan physically hurt me with how bad it was. I just kind of feel like Moffat doesn't understand Who at all. Also like he's addicted to Weeping Angels. I think it was very noticeable how many of the decent episodes were ones he wasn't responsible for, although I am going to miss ~~Amy and~~ Rory.

ty! We'll see what I can do... (If all else fails, I'm tempted to make it my mission to cosplay all eleven Doctors myself. But I might have trouble with Nine, on account of the lack of hair)

(Because we're awesome. Let's go with that)

Yeah, the plot holes were pretty overwhelming, sadly. I think the Weeping Angels are lovely, but they're a far cry from terrifying, which is what a decent chunk of the fandom seems to think they are. And yeah, I agree. I liked Oswin well enough, but the divorce plot with the Ponds just felt like cheap drama and an excuse for lack of communication and development. ~~I'll miss Rory, but Amy, for all that she was less annoying in this season, is another story.~~

If it helps, I planned to be femme!Jack Harkness for Halloween; if you're female-bodied, femme versions might work? (Sadly, my idea didn't pan out, but I had the costume put together and everything.)

(I can live with that. /o/)

I think they were a good idea, but they've been taken so much too far and have so little continuity (first they're quantum-locked so they look like statues, then the Statue of freaking Liberty is an Angel?!) that I don't even know what they are any more. And I liked Oswin, but a lot of what Moffat's said behind the scenes about Companions means my hopes are really not high. ~~I miss Amy only because she brought Rory along. She was just... she really had nothing to her.~~

Femme versions might be the way to go, yeah. (I'm female-bodied, but currently flat-chested enough, and broad-shouldered enough, that I can pass for a feminine man if I try... but female versions might be easier) It's a shame you didn't manage femme!Harkness. Everything is better with Harkness. :p (Also, a. did you get his coat? and b. WHERE?)

I work at a library, and the only thing that makes me feel worse than checking this out to people is checking out blatant slandery rightwing books (did you know that the Crusades were a defensive war and that all American Muslims are in on a conspiracy? Read The Politically Incorrect Guide To Islam and you will!).

And every time someone tells me or their friend that they're romantic or hot or that they just love them, I really want to look them in the eye and ask what is wrong with them. Lay it out as literal rape. And ask why they think that's desirable.

People read anything that becomes popular, and never really objectively think about if it's good or not.

On the one hand, if the books get people out of their sex is dirty and wrong and all smut is bad mindset, that's a good thing. But on the other, I just want to take people who love the books and don't seem to realize how over the top creeptastic Grey is or how badly written they are and sit them down and be like, "Let me introduce you to erotica and online fanfiction that is actually written WELL and doesn't have a stalker for a protagonist or super sketch portrayals of 'BDSM'."

And really, the sex scenes in those books are SO BORING. Like, it's not even an issue of blatantly bad writing and dubious premises, but hot sex scenes.

Oh, the books won't do that. I promise you, people check out plenty of smut. Our romance section is our second biggest fiction section (first being mystery), and it moves like mad. Little old ladies and soccer moms love them some sexy books, and hey, that's fine. But there's this weird disconnect, I think. The books aren't porn, you see, because they're just words and all. But I get the feeling that if I took a comic with a sex scene and showed them that, they'd be tut-tutting.

I really don't get the general public mindset towards romance books. It's weird.

Yeah, I've always found the disconnect there to be pretty annoying. Especially since it sort of perpetuates the social myth (at least in North America--I don't want to speak for the rest of the world, here) that just because it's more socially acceptable for men to acknowledge watching porn, that means that men are "naturally" more drawn to visuals, whereas women are more drawn to the written word. There's a bit more to it than that, like the fact that a lot of mainstream porn caters specifically to heterosexual men and that if a woman talks about reading erotica it's okay, but omg if you bring any sort of picture into it it's dirty and filthy and unfeminine and you are such a perv!!!1 Urgh.

did you know that the Crusades were a defensive war and that all American Muslims are in on a conspiracy?

"It was self-defense, your Honor! He head-butted me in the sword! He head-butted me in the sword TEN TIMES!" --Godfrey of Bouillon.

I cracked up.

I think the issue is that the rape and abuse is so phrased (because she always enjoys it because he's hawt) that it does sound like something desirable and something loving. If you're reading it without thinking about it, I suspect it would be very easy to find them romantic or hot, if all you're taking in is the surface perspective. Which says in so many words that it's romantic and hot. Like... it's disgusting, but if you read it mindlessly, I can see why it would appeal? idk. Making excuses for people now.

And every time someone tells me or their friend that they're romantic or hot or that they just love them, I really want to look them in the eye and ask what is wrong with them.

You know, I don't like these books... but as someone who finds well-written dubcon (or even well-written fantasy noncon) hot, I'm really uncomfortable with "ask what is wrong with them."

Lay it out as literal rape. And ask why they think that's desirable.

People with those kinks don't think rape is desirable. (Well, I'm sure some do. But saying most people are like that? Is very ignorant, and quite insulting.)

I don't think 50 Shades is any kind of good writing, or even sexy. But as someone who has some fantasies that are probably similar to what fuels people's interest in 50, I'm getting really sick of "we have a cultural crisis on our hands; some people like fantasizing about dubious consent!"

It ain't new, and it ain't goin' away.

I'm probably a horrible human being either for thinking or for admitting this, but that actually didn't bother me at all. I mean, I 10000000% with infinite extra zeroes think that would be bad idea jeans in real life.

But in a story? Then I give a bit more leeway.

I thought the point of it was supposed to be that she was getting cold feet, and that that gave the author an excuse for a darkly sexy "Mm, are you *sure* about that, my dear?" sex scene. I could be wrong about it or misremembering it, but it didn't seem like a rape. It seemed like a "I'm attempting a last-minute save before I lose you forever. Oh, thank goodness -- it worked."

I can see calling it dub-con (and anything that's even dub-con? Is NO NO BAD in real life, period end!) but personally, I didn't think it was a rape.

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[ SECRET POST #2137 ]

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