fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2185 ]

[ SECRET POST #2185 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2185 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[not a repeat; was broken yesterday]

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[not a repeat; was broken yesterday]

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 034 secrets from Secret Submission Post #312.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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Spoilers abound, so I'll put some thoughts and reactions in the comment under this one. Hopefully it'll collapse.

So this seemed like a fairly okay episode. Pretty average for Moffat: there was some stuff I liked and some stuff I really didn't and overall it had way too much focus on "ooh look how clever this is" and not enough on "ooh look how in character and emotionally engaging this is".

The bit with Strax and the memory worm was funny in a sort of juvenile way, and the bit with the poor fainting nurse was just flat-out hilarious. I especially loved the line, "I'm a lizard woman from the dawn of time, and this is my wife." At the end of that, I'm surprised Captain Latimer didn't faint too.

The snowmen were suitably creepy, as befits Doctor Who. I feel like they could have emphasized the whole "they show up when you're thinking about them" thing, but the episode wasn't really about the scariness factor, so it would have been a tad distracting. I loved the Intelligence, and honestly I hope it shows up again. Disembodied semi-telepathic vague miasma, can possess people, evil but complex, and voiced by Sir Ian McKellen? There's very little you can do to make that less awesome.

The "one word" bit was... well, on the one hand, it was really corny. Fridge logic tells me that Clara probably should have picked "children" as the primary reason someone named "the Doctor" should help her, because she had no way of knowing the effect "pond" would have. On the other hand... well, it was pretty clever. But this is Moffat, so that's like... like....

If you've seen I think the current season of Project Runway, there was a guy named Ven on the show, and he made it a fair way to the end. He had this gimmick, where he could make these beautiful geometric rose designs out of cloth and incorporate them into clothing. And the thing is he did it really well, and it did look very pretty. But it was all he did, and after the eighth or ninth time he did it, it wasn't breathtaking, it was boring.

And Moffat's clever Doctor Who plots have become basically the same thing. The first time we saw how awesome and foreshadowed and clever his plots were, we thought, "Man, that's the coolest thing ever!" But now it seems like that's all Moffat can do, and I personally am getting sort of tired of watching a one-trick pony.

But let's move on. Vastra and Jenny are canon! I don't know if they were when we saw them before, but they definitely are now, which makes me happy. I kind of wish we'd seen them do something more intimate than just stand close together, but I suspect that had more to do with Vastra's actress being completely painted up to look like a lizard person than with any reluctance on the show's part.

Aaaaaaaaaand once again, we have the same female character from Moffat. I mean, I get that Clara/Oswin are suppposed to be the same person to some extent, but... let's see, is she...
feisty? Check.
smarter than or able to outwit or confound the Doctor? Check.
in love or infatuated with the Doctor? Check.
part of a (potentially annoying) complex plot or subplot involving time, identity, and the question "is she [condition] or isn't she [condition]?" repeated a lot/way too much? According to the trailers, check.

Which is a shame, as was Clara's death. For all that she's the same character as River and Amy and Oswin and so on, I was sort of looking forward to seeing the Doctor's adventures through the lens of "Victorian values," as they kept saying. Instead we get the same 21st-century young pretty Earth girl, leaving basically nothing new that I can see to draw me to watch this character's adventures with the Doctor.

I think that's everything. The TLDR version is that while I liked some individual parts, as a whole this episode kind of annoys me. Other thoughts?

The "one word" bit was... well, on the one hand, it was really corny. Fridge logic tells me that Clara probably should have picked "children" as the primary reason someone named "the Doctor" should help her, because she had no way of knowing the effect "pond" would have. On the other hand... well, it was pretty clever. But this is Moffat, so that's like... like....

Yeah, it was corny. I would have liked it better if the one word was, "Because." That fits the Doctor better. Most of the stuff he does is "because" and nothing more.

Yeah, I agree about Clara - I was really looking forward to a Victorian-era Companion, and her death was actually genuinely sad in a way I wasn't anticipating. ~~Also, for all the flirting she and the Doctor did, I was pretty big on shipping her and Captain Latimer.~~

1) The 'one word' thing. Worst scene in the ep IMO. I just get incredibly frustrated with idiotic plots that are there simply to be mysterious, which is not confined to Dr Who, and I believe is the root of the problem here. Without them giving a real explanation for the one-word thing (Ok, truth vs lies [should have been 'potential lies'] is a fair point, but single word answers is not a logical response; three word answers I could get behind, English language requires modifiers)

2) Oh look Doctor companion flirtation. Never saw that coming. Seriously, either act on it, have the Doctor realise that it doesn't make for a good working environment, or just leave it out. It's getting old.

3) I'm a huge Holmesian, and I was really looking forward to having a Victorian companion, until I realised that time travel stories are really just "author's era plus X". If you look at the technology the previous companions haven't even batted an eyelid at, then take a Victorian to see them, the reactions would be different. Electric lights would be a huge leap forward, storing food as we now do was near-unthinkable etc. I think the beeb is right in thinking that the viewer needs to relate to the companion, we need to see the alien worlds as they see them, and that means they need to be of our era.

So, what are your feelings on the non-modern companions in Old Who, then?

Yeah, I really want to be hopeful about Ms. Oswald. Like I think there are some cool things to be explored with dying but being reborn, and such. But I'm not hopeful for my hope. I'm know we'll probably never get good answers because there's a lot of things I wanted to see explored with Amy (namely the crack in her wall/effects of growing up without parents and then growing up with parents and also your daughter? auuuugh I don't even know anymore).

Also agree that she's just the standard Moffat female lead, so far. I was kind of expecting a change, because of the time period, but alas.

I found the tears bit to be totally cheesy, but that's because I can only take the power of love in limited doses. You did the same thing last year, Moffat.

And though this is full of complaints, I'll finish by saying I was largely engaged with this episode and kept guessing, and that I'm crossing my fingers for the rest of the season.

I'm almost certain Vastra and Jenny were together last time; it was heavily implied, anyway. Not sure if they were married at the time though! That was a nice touch. Those two were probably my favorite part of the entire episode.

As for Clara, I DO like her, but as you've said, she isn't exactly breaking any new ground here. It's good that she has a sense of humor, is spirited and clever, but nothing about her stands out. And I agree that the 'companions flirting with the Doctor' thing is old. (Even if she is adorable while flirting. I hope they keep it 'light-hearted' and to a minimum and don't make it into some huge, recurring deal.)

IDK about anyone else, but Ian McKellen was distracting for me. From the first time I heard his voice a part of me screamed, "WHERE IS GANDALF, FOR I MUCH DESIRE TO SPEAK WITH HIM."

I was looking forward to the idea of having a Victorian-era companion, too. And I was sad when Clara died since, even if she's still alive in the future, Captain Latimer and his children still lost her. I was kind of disappointed that they set up this potential romance between Clara and Latimer and then never really did anything with it.

Also, speaking of Clara, was I the only one who was reminded of Sally Sparrow and her friend exploring the abandoned house when we saw Clara and her friend exploring the cemetery? It was just a few seconds, but if seemed like a similar dynamic.

I agree that the "one word" scene was corny. I understand the effect Moffat was going for, but it felt too contrived for me.

I did enjoy it, though. And Vastra and Jenny are the best! I love them.

Clara/Oswin is River, obviously. She shows up in different time periods, we already knew we hadn't seen the last of River, and how else would it make sense for her to say "pond"?

So there we have it. Moffat's female characters are all the same person, literally.

Aww.... As much as I like this theory, my plothole detector is going off*. First, you didn't account for Amy, who is another cookie-cutter woman, albeit one we see more of. Although I suppose being related to River counts for something.

Second, it did make some sense for Clara to say "pond." First and foremost, she was trying to find a word to describe what had changed, that the Doctor should come help now when he hadn't earlier. Naturally, the first thing that springs to mind is, "Frozen pond." But that's two words, not one, and "frozen" is a little non-specific, I mean, it's the middle of winter. So "pond" is her operative word. So - was the gimmick stupid as hell? Yeah. But was it logical, however flimsy that logic may be? Pretty much, in my book.

*I meant to say that my "plothole detector" gets an awful lot of use when it comes to Doctor Who....

I have to rewatch it, because I didn't quite understand the snowmen plot. I found it a bit silly and hard to pay attention too (I wasn't feeling well when watching it, so there is that).

I LOVED Clara, and I'm super excited for the rest of season 7, and finding out more about her.

Besides, I love all the Sherlock Holmes bits!

All in all, my favourite Christmas Special so far.

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[ SECRET POST #2185 ]

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