fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2212 ]

[ SECRET POST #2212 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2212 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 063 secrets from Secret Submission Post #316.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
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Cool facts: Crowe is a bass-baritone, which for those who don't know is the lower end of the mid-ranged male vocals.

He was singing tenor in a lot of his parts. Well out of his range. Do you know how fucking hard that is?

Then there's the acting he did. He kept emotion in his eyes, and his body was like the immovable wall Javert is supposed to be. I think people are spoiled by people like Quast who are overtly emotional in their movements because they're on stage and things need to be exaggerated, while in a movie they can be way more subdued and still be caught--you don't need someone in the back of the theater to see you, in-person, express emotion from over a hundred feet away. If you pay attention to his eyes and his face overall, but especially the eyes, he does a LOT of acting. And he intimidated the fuck out of me, in the audience, during the opening scene.

For the musically-challenged, why was he singing out of his range? Why not just go with what's right for him?

BC that is how the musical is written.

The better question is: why not hire someone for whom Javert's role would actually be in their vocal range?

Wow you're extremely butthurt.

Am I?

Thanks for letting me know I guess?

Sorry, it's more effective to ask why they bumped up Javert's pieces from a higher baritone to full-on tenor. He could have probably done a higher baritone with less strain on his voice and thus sounding better. But it was suddenly tenor?

Uh, that's a pretty logical question when talking about someone who was hired for a singing role that isn't in their range.

If that's the worst problem, then that's not that bad.

Even then, I'm baffled because all of his parts are actually written in the higher baritone range. Why they were bumped up to tenor for the movie is a mystery to me.

How is it "extremely butthurt" to say hey, maybe they should have just hired someone who could actually sing the part as written?

I didn't realize it was transposed, but if it was, it's possible that it was actually easier for him to hit tenor than high baritone. Midrange can be more difficult for an untrained singer. That said, I can't fathom why they wouldn't go all the way and transpose to a key he could actually sing in at all, or... just hire someone who could sing the part.

That's what I was thinking, which is more baffling. If you're going to change the pitches, why not bump it down into his actual range and now up further out of his range?

IDK, I enjoyed his singing. He had an air of subtlety that I don't see in many Javerts and I think is far more appropriate to the screen. He didn't play him as angry, or as outright obsessed with Valjean--a mistake I despise that is often made in the musical. Their meetings tend to be pure chance, and it's only from Valjean's perspective that there's obsession (which is why he immediately assumes anyone outside his and Cosette's home MUST be Javert and not, you know, thieves). Javert could care less--and he actually outright abandons pursuit of Valjean when revolution is a threat, because, frankly, that's more important than an escaped convict.

Is air of subtlety code for chewing his words like bubble yum? Because if that is the case, then he's the master of the house of air of subtlety.

If that's what you thought it was, I'd bet your ideal Javert is wearing his heart on his sleeve.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2013-01-23 20:08 (UTC) - Expand

Wow. That was a weird overreaction to an extremely placid comment.

It's perfectly reasonable--who cares if it was difficult for him? He wasn't right for the part and did not do the part justice. He also wasn't a great actor in it, either. Explain that one.

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

wait, no it's not written that way

javert's role is famously quite low (lowest note, iirc, is a fucking *bottom f*); it's at the very least a true baritone role

i have no clue what you're talking about re: lyric tenor, but i might hazard a guess that you are not familiar with the show?

in conclusion, russell crowe just didn't have the voice for the role, period. what he did sing - the transposed-higher version - was not great; what he should have sung - what you're claiming he "could have sung" (the iconic baritone role) - he apparently wasn't able to sing, based on the fact that they seem to have *had* to bring the role up for him.

I am familiar with the show.

But tbh, I was not paying too much attention to exactly which notes Crowe was aiming for because I was distracted by the quality of his voice which I was not a fan of and other things. I was mostly just like "YIKES THIS DOESN'T SOUND RIGHT" and uh thus idk I didn't think beyond that to really notice that part of the reason the whole part sounded off was because they had transposed the role to be higher for him.

Also I never claimed that he could have sung the iconic baritone role???

I've read interviews, brosis. They initially chose him for his baritone. Which is why it baffled me as to why they bumped the song up to tenor, and the lady even admits they had trouble getting him up there despite complimenting his low baritone. So I am utterly baffled by the choice, and it's like they were setting him up for the strain.

IDK, the songs he sang are supposed to just be a slightly higher baritone, but by ear of someone who's been in choir for years (I mean, like, 10+), they bumped a lot of it up to tenor for some reason I have yet to find. And it's amazing he was able to do as well as he did. And this is also why, when he got low, he was absolutely amazing.

It's kind of considered sacrilege to transpose (that means to move the music into a key that is more within the singer's range) music for shows. It's like doing "Death of a Salesmen" except everyone suddenly has French accents.

Plus, if they were to transpose the music for Javert, that means every song that he participates in would have to be rewritten to blend with him. Les Miz has some very complicated group performances ("One Day More", especially) that would be very difficult to rewrite to suit one character. It would put the rest of the cast into ranges they probably aren't comfortable in either.

In the first scene? Really? All I could think of when they panned to him in his first shot was "WHAT A WEENIE." I swear, he looked like a penis with a little hat on.

Then blame costuming and French uniforms of the time. But his bit with Valjean after the flag and their little verbal intimidation match left me intimidated.

I KNEW he was singing above his range! I've never done choir or anything and I don't know the distinctions or what a high-C is or anything like that, I was a complete n00b to this musical as well. But when everyone I saw the movie with just flat said Crowe sucked, I was thinking "he sounded like he had to sing higher than he naturally would." Actually, he did sound good in The Confrontation, and if I remember right he randomly got to sing that one an octave lower than everything else.

Yes, in the song in the alley, when Valjean goes to free him, he sings these beautifully low notes that are in his range. And he sounds outright sinister, which is something I've never heard from a Javert there. I have literally no idea WHY they had him singing above his range, but he was and it's a damn shame.

He kept emotion in his eyes, and his body was like the immovable wall Javert is supposed to be.

It doesn't matter if the emotion's in his eyes. It's got to come out of his voice. It's a musical; close your eyes and you should be able to imagine the face.

And that was my big problem with Crowe. I thought he had a decent enough voice; he just was too wrapped up in singing the notes to actually sing the song.

Except we're not at a stage play. We're at a movie. I'm not going to a movie theater to sit in the dark with my eyes closed. Part of a movie theater is the visual experience, so you can't apply the typical musical theater experience to it. Which is why I enjoyed this version of Javert. I get tired of seeing exaggerated motions and having to rely on voice to the point of I may as well just be listening to a damn soundtrack. That he made Javert into the emotional brick wall I always assumed he was supposed to be on the outside while still having him affected by things inside was amazing to me. It's like he'd read the notes on the Javert of my heart. I mean, shit, the medal scene and his expressions there had me bawling in the middle of a crowded theater.

He got to bring something new to the role, which is amazing since it seems everyone plays Javert almost exactly the fucking same and it got boring after awhile. Yeah, yeah, if it ain't broke, but this girl's first experience was her best friend babbling about the book and how awesome Javert was as a character, so I'm irrationally pissed at the musical for making him an incompetent, angry shell of who he should be, and was thankful the movie took a few pages from the book to make him seem less like a goddamn moron who sucked at his job.

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