fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2290 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2289 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02.

[Dangan Ronpa]

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03.

[Berserk]

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04.

[Thomas Was Alone]

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05.

[Paranatural]

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06.

[Supernatural]

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07.

[Christoph Waltz]

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08.

[Lost In Austen]

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09.

[Les Miserables]

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10.

[Harry Potter]

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11.

[Amanda Palmer]

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12.

[Bioshock Infinite]

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13.

[Red Riding Hood]

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14.

[Girls Next Door]

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15.

[Arthur]

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16.

[Roosterteeth]

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 038 secrets from Secret Submission Post #327.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I do understand some of the frustration from that angle, but at the same time I feel like if characters from minority races can't be portrayed as complex and varied as white characters--even if it means that they're villains sometimes--then they'll never be portrayed as really equal or as viable characters? (it could be that I just play too many JRPGs and such to see the problem, though. I only ever play shooters if they're co-op like Left 4 Dead or if they're heavy on story like BI.)

Maybe some more POC allies would've been helpful? All I can think of off the top of my head is the gunsmith (sort of) and the mixed-race couple (if you throw the ball at the announcer).

But Daisy wasn't complex or varied. She was oppressed, lashed out, tried killing a kid later. That's not complex at all.

then they'll never be portrayed as really equal or as viable characters?

Yes, but when you have very, very few heroic black characters? This argument falls apart then. And the portrayal of black men in JRPGs is almost always funny black men being totally so black because Japan is massively racist and thinks black guys are hilarious.

Maybe some more POC allies would've been helpful?

It would have been. You do have several sympathetic white characters, even heroic.

That said, the game was about extremism. It's clear the second half of the game suddenly got a huge development shift, because it's clearly setting up this huge civil war and that all gets ignored so it can be refocused on Elizabeth and Booker. The issue is it looks like the devs were *trying* to set up a story that would have more characters, deeper themes, a more complex philosophy that let you understand better the extremism of the first half...but then it gets abandoned. So you're left with your ridiculously over the top extremist lunatics.

this. Daisy (or anyone not named Elizabeth or Booker, really) was very one-note, which was disappointing, especially since all the previews hyped up the Vox/Founders conflict. And then the halfway point comes and the game entirely shifts gears, which wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing but it comes at the expense of the themes and characters they set up in the first half. It's like they came up with all these cool concepts but didn't know how to piece them all together so just went "fuck it" and decided to focus on timey wimeyness instead. Ken Levine said they had to cut about 5 games worth of content and it definitely shows.

But Daisy wasn't complex or varied. She was oppressed, lashed out, tried killing a kid later. That's not complex at all.

She didn't start out that way, though. I've only played the preorder minigame and the game itself, but between those both I got a pretty good idea of how Daisy STARTED with good intentions and ended up as extreme as she did. I wouldn't be surprised if more supplemental materials expand on that even more. (Isn't there a novel about the rise of the Vox?)

Yes, but when you have very, very few heroic black characters? This argument falls apart then.

What about the three black characters in Left 4 Dead 1 and 2? Lee and Clementine in The Walking Dead? Yes, there should be more, but we are getting black heroes, and I don't like the idea that all black characters should be heroes (any more than all female characters in games should be heroic). I want more heroes for sure, but I'll take one character that's actually interesting and well thought out over 10 characters from some sort of oppressed minority or subgroup that are portrayed as good people but are otherwise just...bland.

I do agree that they had a little TOO much plot for their own good, though. It would've been nice if they focused a bit more on the Vox after Comstock House and cleaned up some of those plot wholes before the big timey wimey reveal.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, it wasn't PERFECT, and I would've liked more time with Daisy but I also think that the people saying that the Vox should've been good guys is way off base.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that we'll either get DLC where we can play as Martyr!Booker or Daisy herself. That's my dream.

It did in some of the demos. Like the "trial" of the public worker that paralleled the opening lottery a bit.

We do have DLC coming. It did promise more story...

But... Clementine isn't black??

She was designed so that she could "look like she was Lee's daughter." I know she has lighter skin than Lee does but she still looks black to me?

pretty sure she is supposed to be black. like above anon said, she was designed to look like she could be lee's daughter, and her skin color and hair are very similar to that of one of my black friends so yeah, i'd say she's black.

[ SECRET POST #2290 ]

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