fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2363 ]

[ SECRET POST #2363 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2363 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 05 pages, 118 secrets from Secret Submission Post #337.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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As a cartoon-obsessed kid who was incredibly fond of and grateful to any kid-aimed show or book that didn't talk down to me while also being cool and entertaining, I say "pfffft" to you, friend. That show was groundbreaking for its time...and maybe for today, too, because I'm struggling to think of a more recent Western animated show to compare it to and all I'm coming up with is the Marvel and DC round up and maybe Avatar: The Last Airbender.

To be fair, I just tried to rewatch the Justice League animated series and was kind of disappointed by it (whereas Batman and Batman: Beyond remain the best things ever), so maybe Gargoyles won't have aged well now that I'm an adult. Heading to Netflix now to test this hypothesis.

I'd be curious to know your thoughts on how it's aged. The last time I saw it was three years ago now and it was still entertaining, but it was also a kind of comfort thing. So I'd be really interested in hearing a more objective opinion on it than mine if it's no trouble. :D

Also because I don't have cable tv anymore and my connection sucks, so streaming can be super painful.

Netflix doesn't have it streaming, sadly, but some enterprising souls on Youtube have been very generous. I'll comment here with opinions on the first few episodes if you're still interested later tonight, anon. ^^

(And as someone who had a shitty connection until recently and couldn't stream, either, Youtube is okay so long as you let the video load in full before watching it. I've managed long videos that way, so long as I didn't try that trick at peak hours).

Sorry to Anon-barge in, but you don't need Netflix to watch Gargoyles.

I tend to watch it here:

http://video.disney.com/shows/gargoyles-4ba34a5545c1259e961b9666

It's every episode without commercials *and* you don't have to go through the effort of downloading anything.

Holy shit, I really had no idea it was up for free and legally or I would have rewatched it long ago. Thank you, anon!

I certainly would be!

Maybe it's my browser too, but youtube also likes to suddenly stall out when I'm watching things. Perhaps I'll try that other anon's disney link at some point, but for now I think I'll stick to ice cream and cursing the gods of rural dsl.

If you're still checking this thread, anon, I finished the first five episodes (the "Awakening" setup), and they were awesome. The animation has held up well and the writing is still excellent, good dialogue, moral ambiguity, solid humor, all great. Some stuff I question more than when I was a kid - like how Scottish gargoyles speak perfect modern English, how 500 pound creatures are able to glide anywhere on wings smaller than they are, and of course why there couldn't have been at least one girl among the surviving clan before Angela came along - but it's little criticisms compared to how engaging I still find the show. Elisa's relentless badassery remains the best thing about it, and I felt the old shipper in me squealing at the beginning of her and Goliath's relationship. Not to mention that Demona and Xanathos remain two of my favorite characters despite their wickedness (I think I ship that, too, just a little). Even knowing how it's all gonna play out, I still look forward to seeing it all over again.

I'm probably going to end up marathoning the rest of it and then hitting the fandom again for the first time in more than a decade. Bless this thread for hooking me back onto one of my favorite childhood cartoons.

(Also, I hope you have some luck with the Disney site, it also loads data instead of streaming continuously, which is better for a slow connection. Gargoyles is worth the attempt!)

The 2003 TMNT cartoon was pretty awesome and fairly savage in places as well (okay, depending on the season). Baxter Stockman's entire storyline was pretty much horror and uneasy comedy in a downward spiral into insanity, and some of the plots with Agent Bishop and with Donatello in particular were brutal. And Leo. And Shredder. It was actually fairly heavy all round, now that I think about it.

B:TAS and Batman Beyond will always be the best ever. Though ... does anyone remember a spin-off from BB called The Zeta Project? I seem to remember that being fairly adult as well, though I haven't seen it in years ...

I vaguely remember trying to watch the 2003 one and finding it amusing but not terribly engaging, but I might be confusing those memories with the campy original series. And yes, I remember liking the Zeta Project! I mean, I watched the whole thing until they cancelled it, but I couldn't begin to tell you the major plot points, haha. The years have not been kind to my memory.

The first two seasons traded light episodes with dark, but seasons three and four tended towards darker. The famous 'Same As It Never Was' episode was S3 (Donatello in a dystopian future), as well as the heavy parts of the Triceraton wars, and S4 had the dark end of Agent Bishop's plot, culminating in the 'Good Genes' two-parter and 'Insane in the Membrane'. Um. They were fairly dark. Mind you, even S1 started to show the trend with Leo's loss against the Shredder, and S2 had the whole 'City At War' arc. There were some hilarious episodes in there, but the 2003 series was pretty damn dark. I loved it with a passion. As you can probably tell from me remembering episode names off the top of my head ;)

I only vaguely remember Zeta, since the years haven't been much kinder to me, but I remember there was a lot of discussion about robots and AI and how even programmed assassins can change if given reason. Plus the relentless pursuit of an innocent soul because he was a remorseless killing machine (literally) before his sleeper programming kicked in.

I really need to find that cartoon again ...

Season 1 of TMNT 2003 also had the bit with Leo decapitating the Shredder, which was pretty dark. Yeah, it was just a robot body and Shredder picked the head back up at the end of the episode, but at the time the episode first aired the audience didn't know that yet -- I remember the first time I watched it being like "Holy crap, did they just show that on a kid's cartoon? Okay, it's gotta be a robot suit because there's no way they'd get away with this otherwise." (And a somewhat more subtle but still notable moment of darkness -- Leo didn't know that either, so we still have a kid's show where the hero decapitated the villain and gave no fucks about it. Still my favorite Turtles series.)

Yeah, Leo and the Shredder built a fantastically dark interaction from more or less that scene. I was always a Donatello girl, so I mostly remembered the arcs that focused on him, but holy shit did Leo have some moments of going off the deep end. That little moment at the start there, it did offer a premonition.

It was absolutely my favourite turtles series, though I'd seen the 80s series before it and liked that as well. But then this one happened, and I kind of never looked back.

Never saw S5 or S6, though. Well, I saw some scenes, but I think one of them involved the turtles becoming dragons. Which, ah, baffled me enough that I didn't check up on those two. Although I think one of them had a future version of Bishop who was the good guy, which might be worth going back for.

I watched the 80s show religiously as a kid and it was probably my first-ever favorite show, but the 2003 series won me over completely by mid-way through season 1. Particularly since my favorite character has actually always been Splinter so I forever love the 2003 series just because it let him be a badass on a regular basis. His fight against the Foot Mystics in the Return to New York arc is one of my favorite fights in all of TMNT.

I've seen all but the last season (Back to the Sewers) which I only managed to catch bits and pieces of. The bit with the turtles becoming dragons would be the Lost Season/Ninja Tribunal arc, which is technically season 5 but aired out of order because the network opted to air Fast Forward, the one with Future Bishop, instead. I wouldn't recommend Fast Forward at all, unfortunately -- all the great dark stuff of the earlier seasons is mostly filtered out and it's distinctly more kid-friendly than its predecessors. I don't think they ever really properly explain the Bishop thing, it's basically just 'yeah, now he's good. And stuff.' Even the art style's kinda 'meh' (and they stopped drawing Leo with the cut in his shell from Karai, which always bugged me since I liked the continuity of having it there). The Lost Season's pretty good though. The dragon thing gets decently well explained and it's very plot-heavy, since the episode count is so much lower than the previous seasons (it's only 12 episodes to the previous seasons' 26). Overall Fast Forward and what I saw of Back to the Sewers really feel like almost a different (and worse) show to me than S1-4 + Ninja Tribunal.

Splinter was a boss. I think my favourite parts of the Big Brawl arc were Mikey getting a chance to be awesome and the revelation that pretty much the entire fighting universe thinks Master Splinter kicks ass.

Hmm. I think I'll definitely Lost Season, then. And possibly Fast Forward, just to see, but that bit about the shell would really bug me too. Not just for continuity, but that scar was a big part of Leo's character in later seasons, a mark of what he'd been through and who he'd become (for better or worse). I always liked that about the show, that people visibly paid in ways physical and otherwise for what they went through.

Man, now you're making me want to watch that version of TMNT again. I'm pretty sure I didn't make it to seasons three and four (loss of TV access), and it sounds like it would fit right in with my nostalgic rewatch list.

If you Google "Zeta Project streaming", you'll find some yo-ho-ho sites that provide it. The first hit is a particular favorite of mine. Also I totally forget Zeta used appearance holograms, lol.

Hey, always worth a second look :) S3 starts off with a massive six-part storyline about the Triceraton Wars, which is fun and involves a lot of rescuing each other from spaceships. Plus, I think it also introduced Agent Bishop, and that is never a bad thing. (See also 'Hun on the Run' from the same season for more awesome Bishop - he's a baddie but he had style).

Thank you! I really have been meaning to rewatch Zeta for months now.

Y'know, I'm pretty behind on the 2003 show, but has anyone here seen that movie they did that incorporated all of the versions of TMNT, from the goofiest of the 80's to the grimdark of the original? Because that was pretty sweet.

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[ SECRET POST #2363 ]

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