fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2562 ]

[ SECRET POST #2562 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2562 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 044 secrets from Secret Submission Post #366.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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Pagan religions are older religions than Christianity...

Paganism as it's practiced now was for all intents and purposes created wholecloth in the twentieth century.

Which doesn't mean Chard isn't projecting like a motherfucker because some atheist hurt her feelings or something (seems to be a particular nerve?), but paganism is very new.

That's what it seems to me as well. She sure as hell isn't acting like good Christian given how passionate she is about it, though.

Why does she have to behave Christianly? What if she's not a Christian?

You appear to think being informed means being passionate.

I was raised catholic. You definitely couldn't call me a devout christian at this point but I get angry when people get basic details wrong. Also you have to know religion to understand history because people are hella religious.

Even atheists are religious. They're religious about not being religious.

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ill_omened - 2014-01-08 20:37 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 21:21 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 23:38 (UTC) - Expand

Nah, I'm just tired of atheists looking like even worse assholes than the evangelicals lately.

Nice job managing to be an asshole about both myself and pagans, though! There are plenty of ways to say what you did in a sensitive way.

I wasn't at all insulting paganism. I know some fucking cool pagans. I just don't think it makes MORE sense than major religions. That doesn't mean it makes less sense.

Didn't see anything in ill_omened's comment that said anything negative about paganism or implied you were insulting paganism. They just confirmed that the form of paganism practiced today is new. Which is what you were saying.

FWIW, I understood what you meant wrt to paganism. I'm pagan myself, and something that annoys me in a number of pagan communities is the superiority and bashing of other religions. They don't work for you? Great. You want to talk about your negative experiences with $religion? Sure, go ahead. But when you start stating in an objective way that paganism is so much better than $religion... no, just no. It's better for YOU. Shitting on other people's religious choices because you think $religion sucks just makes you an asshole.

/may have feelings about this

'Asshole' evangelicals literally believe gay people are burning in hell, and contribute to a culture in which having sex with men can get you seriously hurt or killed.

And what, obnoxious atheists at worst contribute to some dumb quotes on reddit, and a culture where if you say the wrong thing on a tiny minority of websites you might get told you're dumb? This isn't even close to comparable, and I'm not going to let you pretend like it is. South Park as funny as it can occasionally be shouldn't inform your worldview.

p.s. if you can literally trace 99% of your religion back to some random civil servant, that does make it less legitimate than something with a lineage as extensive as christianity. Not a lot to be sure, but just a little.

What the fuck does South Park have to do with anything? Did you seriously think I got this from South Park?

Anyway, yes, you're right. Christianity is way more legitimate because we can trace our lineage back to a bunch of civil servants who worked for CONSTANTINE, thank you very much.

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 23:49 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 23:49 (UTC) - Expand

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chardmonster - 2014-01-09 00:12 (UTC) - Expand

It depends on which brand of paganism you're talking about.

Hinduism? Fits my description of paganism - not based in any way on Abrahamic mythology, and has multiple gods who often represent certain virtues. Hinduism is not some new religion made from whole cloth in the 20th century.

I will however agree that neo-pagan beliefs based on Earth Mother/Triple Goddess/Horned God traditions, or based on the pantheons of cultures like Ancient Greece, Rome, Egypt are just as you say. Just because those pantheons were once legitimately worshiped religions once does not mean the modern pagan following aren't anything more than new religions - the ancient followings died out long ago under the pressure of the Roman Catholic juganaught.

Yes, but maybe she's referring to neopagans? Modern day paganism is pretty inauthentic after all. And I am one. Lol

Some of them - the Olympic pantheon, for example. Gardnerian 'wicca' paganism? Nope. See comment below.

I even think Hellenistic paganism is a bit of a new thing - the ancient Greek religions died out long ago (or were killed off by early Christianity after it got government backing). What exists now is a modern interpretation of a dead religion based solely on what information was left behind in writings and art (which likely does not include the "mysteries" of any of those religions).

Not the modern interpretations practiced by most nerds.

Like most Christian denominations older than Orthodoxy?

How is Judeo-Christian mythology any less nerdier, I wonder?

They practically invented canon wars.

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 01:26 (UTC) - Expand

...it just occurred to me that whole denominations rise and fall according to Judeo-Christian canon wars. Fought with actual cannons, sometimes!

(Though is there anything that really cannot be nerdy [in the sense of having devotees with a greatly-consuming interest or passion for it])?

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 01:25 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 01:30 (UTC) - Expand

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chardmonster - 2014-01-08 01:45 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2014-01-08 02:11 (UTC) - Expand

*any less nerdy

Which pagan religions? If you're talking, say, heathenism, then no. Some scholars even think the nordic religion borrowed from middle-eastern Christianity originally. Christianity has been around a very long time, longer than many older European religions as we (and modern pagan practitioners) understand them.

Uh, got sources for that? Christianity did a lot of borrowing from pagan religions, I'd be skeptical about it happening the other way around. And I'm really not sure what you mean, of course paganism is older than Christianity, there is no debate about that. Not the paganism that modern day neopagans practice, of course.

I'm assuming they're talking about the fact that the main codification of Norse pagan mythology we have (the Younger Edda) was written by a Christian and clearly has some Christian influences in it. But it was written well after the society in question had converted to Christianity. On the other hand, during the period of time when both Christianity and paganism coexisted in the various Norse societies, I would not be in the least surprised to find that pagan worshippers borrowed some Christian elements -- paganism was far, far less focussed on having a specific canon of knowledge and ideas, so new elements could come in relatively easily. Bbut since we have very little evidence of what was actually going on, since pagans didn't write anything down, it's all speculation.

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