fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2576 ]

[ SECRET POST #2576 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2576 ⌋

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I know a lot of people don't like it in their sci-fi or whatever, but what about people who do? Are there writers who have done it well? Personally I like love stories, but I think romance as a genre is ready for a change.

I personally enjoy romance... as a B plot. I need something else going on with the actual story, and for the romance to be developing in the background. Romance as a primary storyline just wouldn't hold my interest, but I like it when characters fall in love while they're saving the world or whatever.

Yes, exactly this.

Awwwwww, your icon! <3

Bingo. Even if it's a character-focused story there NEEDS to be something else going on.

Lois McMaster Bujold.

Nothing else to say at the present moment.

Seconding this, definitely.

Re: Let's talk about romance plots!

(Anonymous) - 2014-01-22 05:45 (UTC) - Expand

Two words: The Mummy (the 1999 one, not the one with Boris Karloff). Rare example of "romantic subplot in an action movie" done right, if you ask me.

IMO, what makes a good romance is not writing it from a romance approach. Too many writers approach with 'boy + girl = plot'*, which is wrong. It should be 'boy + girl + plot = story'. Characters need to fill a role bigger than simply 'love interest'. Make Boy an interesting character is his own right, Girl an interesting character in her own right, and give them a reason to be together. Add additional plot as desired.

* Or boy + boy, girl + girl, whatever.

This is basically how I approach it too. My current project became 500% better when the main character's love interest became the one to cause a certain problem in the plot.

I think there's a difference between not liking it and not liking how it tends to take the focus away from the entirety of the series.

For example, say the series has always focused on the dynamic between A and B. B and C fall in love, and suddenly, it's like A and B never had any dynamic whatsoever, and maybe even resent one another because A was also in love with C. (See: Wesley and Gunn from Angel.) While this does happen in real life, in-series it completely changes one of the things I may have really liked about it.

So I like romance plotlines where dynamics or other aspects of the series aren't drastically altered, but the couple are still, you know, a couple. I like couples that clearly grew together. I love couples who lack angst, save for situations where obviously there would be some - I want them to be happy, to have real problems of course, everyone does, but to work through them like adults.

I like them most as either a) a subplot that doesn't take over the main plot but accentuates the human element within the larger story -- like Han/Leia in Star Wars; or b) as a method of bringing certain themes and ideas that the story is really about to the surface. I'm not a huge fan of romance stories that are only romance stories, unless they're temporary arcs in a show.

But when the romance is done right, and when it's small enough in the grand scheme of things...boy do I get a kick out of it. :)

There's two different things here:

1) Romance in sci-fi. No, I don't think I've ever seen it done well, but I tend to gravitate towards sci-fi that's more focused on plot & worldbuilding. The one exception I would give to that is Mortal Engines (a YA/A sci-fi novel, kinda dystopian steampunk.) I enjoyed the romance in that because the characters were interesting, and it furthered the plot instead of taking away from it.

2) Romance as a separate genre. I agree with your opinion. I've tried reading romance novels, but so far, I haven't found one I've enjoyed. Mainly because most of them seem to have creepy borderline-rapists & serial killers as the heroes, as well as a lot of sexist tropes. Not my cup of tea.

You might be able to find something you like through the reviews here: http://smartbitchestrashybooks.com/
They point out when things are sexist and when the heroes are actually creepy rapist types, and those books don't tend to get good reviews. I've only heard of one that had anything to do with serial killers, though, that's odd.

Re: Let's talk about romance plots!

(Anonymous) - 2014-01-22 04:26 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Let's talk about romance plots!

(Anonymous) - 2014-01-22 08:26 (UTC) - Expand

I love romance in fiction, but I don't like the romance genre. It's so formulaic and the characters so often fall flat. When romance is the main element of a story, it seems way too easy for the only defining trait to be a character's feelings for another, and the only plot points to be related to being together (or not).

But I started out my current novel intending a story free of romance, and then two of the characters had so much chemistry. I still avoided most full-on romance but had to settle for implication-that-they-get-together-afterward.

Ha, I am kind of the opposite. I love romance as a genre but I don't like romance outside of that generally in my fiction.

People fall in love, and that's a part of life. Heck, even asexual people fall in love, depending on how they lean. I think a story that's totally devoid of that kind of loses some of the intimacy and humanity and makes characters feel less like people.

But... I don't really want to see it as the main driving force of a story unless it's really incredibly well done. I'm not into romance as a genre, but if I book doesn't even mention it I end up feeling like something's missing.

I've seen it done well. Sadly when it is done well the book is normally by a woman and so it gets shoved into the 'romance' section.

I agree with the opinions that say it works better as a sub-plot. Give me something interesting that is happening, and the romance makes it feel better - gives it heart - but don't lose sight of the rest of the plot in favour of the romance.

I usually avoid the romance genre in published stuff, it's full of too many crappy tropes. I rather read a sci-fi or fantasy novel where romance happens, but is not the main plot of the story.

People act like romantic love is the be-all end-all, but I think it's important but not all there is to life. So as a compliment to a family story, or an action story, or a mystery, sure! Great! But if the only conflict is romantic conflict? Snooze city.

I agree with whoever said The Mummy was a great example of romance subplot done right. Thor is the worst I've ever seen.

I don't mind it in my sci-fi or action, but if I'm yelling at the screen "STOP CANOODLING holy shit you are about to get EATEN by a GIANT ROBOT!!1" then you're not doing it right. I actually liked the romance in Transformers, but their mushy talk was ill-timed. Pacific Rim was subtle and good. I liked in the Chanur novels that there was a touch of romance but always with accompanying "I don't have time for this shit, deal with your drama after I have finished deciding the political fate of this whole region of space." (I also liked that the menfolk were considered emotionally unstable and good only for fighting and sexing, before they started to realize oh hey maybe men do have brains, but that's another story)

Best sci-fi love stories:

John Crichton/Aeryn Sun
Saul and Ellen Tigh

Re: Let's talk about romance plots!

(Anonymous) - 2014-01-22 06:35 (UTC) - Expand

Karen Lord's "Best of All Possible Worlds" has some nice development. So does Budjold by refusing to play the extended misunderstanding game.

I like romance in romantic comedies but I generally don't in sci-fi or procedurals. I guess it's because I'm usually not interested in both of the characters equally (which I really have to do to ship a pairing) or the pairing I like doesn't go canon (like in The Killing or this slash pairing I'm into). I guess I don't like it when romance is awkwardly forced in, or it draws focus from other aspects of a show I like (like other characters or the plot). Then again, there's one I'm thinking of now where the romance came out of nowhere and it was only hinted at previously and that was just...a terrible pairing, period. I don't know, OP.

Honestly I think I am the most cynical motherfucker sometimes because I dislike or don't care about 99% of all romance plots. Having it as a b-plot is my preference, like everyone else, but the vast majority don't pique my interest. That's kinda why I would never read something that's from the romance genre unless it was very well done, sorry OP.

The only exception to this rule would be The Less Than Epic Adventures of TJ and Amal. It's a buddy roadtrip and a romance blended together but since it avoids everything I dislike about romance stories it goddamn wins me over. (Seriously read this shit y'all)

In fact, one of the reasons I like it so much is that when one character is caught out on doing something bad the other GETS APPROPIATELY ANGRY and gives them the riot act. Goddamn it is so damn rare for one love interest to get justifiably angry and react like an adult about it. In most stories they'd run off in a trail of tears and then get hit by a car oh noes waaaaaah and then make up like it never happened.

But in this story they, again, act like adults about it and manage to move on after a healthy amount of anger and distrust.

Hell, that's my biggest problem with the genre - it tends to go for what's the most dramatic and heart-wrenching rather than what makes sense for those characters. Also I've noticed that most romance stories don't believe that two people in love could never have serious reasons to dislike or get angry with each other that can't just be fixed with love, which is why 99% of star-crossed lovers never seem real to me.

Uh, shit, I've rambled. Sorry OP.

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