[ SECRET POST #2584 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2584 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.
[Danball Senki Wars]


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02.
[Harry Potter]


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03.
[Burn Notice]


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04.
[The Island of Doctor Moreau]


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05.
[Papers, Please]


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06.
[Star Trek: The Next Generation]


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07.
[Pretty Little Liars]


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08.
[KILL LA KILL]


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09.
[Labyrinth, The Hobbit]

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10.
[The Hobbit]


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11.
[The Hobbit]


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12.
[The Kiss of the Spider Woman]














Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 029 secrets from Secret Submission Post #369.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

12. http://i.imgur.com/qRuwWxZ.jpg
[The Kiss of the Spider Woman]

[(Anonymous)]

Every time I see Raul Julia now I automatically think of Frank Langella's autobiography.

[(Anonymous)]

I thought you were going to say you thought of fingalsanteater!

[(Anonymous)]

Nope, that wouldn't have happened.

[kamino_neko]

Why?

[(Anonymous)]

He plays a semi-prominent role in it.

[kamino_neko]

Well, yes, that was taken as read. My question was 'how so'?

[(Anonymous)]

Why? What do the two have in common?

[(Anonymous)]

Because they were "soulmates" or words to that effect.

OP

[(Anonymous)]

Every time I see Raul Julia I'm just like, "holy smoke this man is attractive".

[(Anonymous)]

I think I'll check this movie out.

[(Anonymous)]

It's even a book.

Wow, really?

[(Anonymous)]

I had no idea!!! Thanks for informing me!

Re: Wow, really?

[(Anonymous)]

YES!!!! FUCKING REALLY!!!!!!!

OP

[(Anonymous)]

I read the book first, then about a year later finally got my hands on the movie. Both are great, and I think can be read in whichever order you prefer, but I definitely recommend not neglecting the book, even if you're not a huge reader.

Anyway, glad my secret worked as a recommendation. :)

[(Anonymous)]

True story:

My last semester in Junior College, I made friends with a girl in my English class who was also fannish. She was more into anime, I was more a book girl, but it was really nice to have someone in real life that you could say "My mind started wandering to this fic I'm reading and OMG I swear I almost started crying in class" to and get an "I feel you". Anyhoo, she was a hardcore yaoi-lover, to the point that I mentioned hetero fic and she pretty seriously said, "that exists?"

Our last read of the semester was Kiss of the Spider Woman. I freaked out when it looked like everyone else had started reading it and I read the whole thing in one sitting (and accidentally got ahead of the whole class). My friend meanwhile was swamped with a different class and hadn't had time to get very far in the book. So we were walking together to the bus stop after class, on an extremely crowded city street, and I said, "you mind if I spoil you on the book?" and she said "sure" and I said "gay sex" and she threw her arms in the air and yelled "YAY!"

Good times.

[(Anonymous)]

That's a cute story. :)

[ginainthekingsroad]

I can totally relate, late-20s-OP. KotSW isn't quite my cup of tea, but I am definitely the one talking political context and stagecraft theory after seeing a musical. Well any theatrical performance, actually; but I will also defend musical theatre as "legitimate" theatre and just as worthy of discussion and analysis as straight plays/operas.

[inevitableentresol]

That book is so good. Read it several times.

I liked the movie version better at first because the book is so incredibly sad. The movie at least leaves us in a little happy sparkly fantasy world to finish.

I must have never grown up, because I'm still dazzled by the (canon) sex scene and the gripping build up and I don't really want to know about the scary politics.

But lubeless sex. Ouch every time I read! I mean, it fits with his character - but come on.

OP

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, the lubeless sex, yikes. I like to pretend there is some kind of lubrication, and the (straight, I think?) author just forgot to mention it.

I think it's a mixture of both the sexual tension and how their political views mold their conversations - Valentin's progressive view of the world, informed by idealist communism and Molina's somewhat conservative views on gender, but also how ambiguous his gender politics are (is he just a feminine man or does he truly want to be a woman, as he says?).

Re: OP

[inevitableentresol]

I think the lubeless sex was deliberate. Molina has a huge masochistic streak, especially in his desire for non-feminine, non-'gay' men, and Valentin would just be 'straight' and clueless. There's a huge deal made about how it hurts Molina and how he kind of wants that. Everything else they do (their laundry, toiletries, meals and clothes) is painstakingly described. Use of any of their precious provisions for lube would be a big deal and is glaring in omission.

But I'm not sure it's actually possible, I mean with the penetrator enjoying it. It's still a shockingly hot scene, but only just. It's the only time I think I've went along with lubeless sex scene. There's so many other ugh things that happen to those guys and their build up is so good.

On re-reading, the long passages where Molina re-tells propaganda films in a dreamy, romantic light are my favourite bits. The first time, I was speed reading, trying to get to the action. On re-reads, I realised they are the action and have several levels to enjoy.

I think one of the triumphs of the book is that the gender politics sill seem relevant, even though both characters have quite outdated views. As long as I avoid the footnotes - there's one in particular about studies of gays that I really wish the author hadn't included. I have to hurriedly ignore it each time. He should have let his work do the talking.

Re: OP

[(Anonymous)]

OP here again. You're right about the descriptions - I'd forgotten because it's been a while since I read the book.

It's definitely a book of its time. The footnotes made me raise an eye-brow or two as well, but even with all those flaws, there's so many interesting layers to it, like you said. You really get inside these characters, and all of their biases and flaws as well, and it's fascinating. Back when I first read it, it made me wonder a lot about gender roles and art and role models (since I feel one reason why Molina loved his film heroines so much was because they could express their femininity so freely and he wanted that for himself, a sort of more free gender expression which we are still fighting for).

There were also parts where I wondered whether what happened between them was genuine or the type of desperation that happens for people with little to no prospects in life (particularly Valentin). Like was it love, lust, or just a search for an intimate human bond of some kind, or a little of all of the three?

I really should buy it and re-read, either in English or the Finnish (my native tongue). It's too bad I can't read the Spanish original.

[dimestoresaint]

This movie was recc'd to me by a college professor and I still haven't gotten around to seeing it. Narrowly missed my chance at Cannes the year it screened in their Classics selection, and then it sat on my Netflix queue for so long I didn't notice when they pulled it. Thanks for reminding to me to try and track it down again, OP.

OP

[(Anonymous)]

No problem. The book is an interesting read, too. It's almost entirely in dialogue, one of the first novels to do that.

[(Anonymous)]

Ooh! A "Kiss Of the Spider Woman" secret!