[ SECRET POST #2756 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2756 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 076 secrets from Secret Submission Post #394.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets (random images from what appears to be one spammy anon) ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[world_eater]

The debate upthread is highly amusing to me, because in my fandom fluff actually means all the background story and all that jazz.


But maybe we're doing it wrong? ;D

[nyxelestia]

It probably depends on fandom. If it's a lighthearted fandom (or lighthearted fic is common), then fluff can include canon background and such. But most of the "big" fandoms tend to be much darker, so fluff is used to not only indicate the actual content of the fic, but also differentiate it from the tone of the canon or the fandom norm.

[world_eater]

It's Wh40k, it's both big and dark.

[nyxelestia]

I have no idea what Wh40k is.

[(Anonymous)]

Warhammer 40k

[nyxelestia]

Ah. Well, I actually still have no idea what that is. Oh, well - what's the fandom norm (i.e. people's perceptions of the goings-in on the fandom, fanworks, etc., regardless of the tone of canon)? :)

[world_eater]

What's the fandom norm of what? Are you asking if the fanworks are lighthearted?

[nyxelestia]

Fanworks, meta, interactions, etc.

I mean I know they can be incredibly diverse, but in my experience fandoms - or at least sub-fandoms - will overall lean towards general directions (so ATLA/Legend of Korra fandom tends to run a wee bit darker than canon, while conversely Hannibal had a reputation for a while of being a downright ridiculous fandom given it's a show about murder and cannibalism).

[world_eater]

Woah, I've never thought of it like that, but you're right. That's kind of fascinating and I wonder what triggers directions like that?

[nyxelestia]

I suspect it's largely a reaction to the canon material itself, i.e. in ATLA/LOK fandom(s), the shows often address fairly dark themes (war, genocide, political conflicts where both sides have valid points, power dynamics, etc.)...but it's a kids show, which means a lot of the darker or more explicit details tend to get glossed over or handwaved away. Fandom compensates for that via slightly darker fanworks. On the flip side, Hannibal is already exceedingly dark, and psychologically complex - it's a show that makes people a little uncomfortable is supposed to make them feel a little uncomfortable. And as everyone (except perhaps certain SJWs) can tell you, one of the best ways to cope with anything from discomfort to horror and trauma is to joke about it, so fandom gets cracky.

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

As far as I can tell, Warhammer is what happens when you have a tabletop RPG that is combined with model collecting for the sake of laying out battles on a miniature landscape.

Warhammer Fantasy is not that far from Dungeons and Dragons. Warhammer 40K is is Warhammer IN SPACE! With space marines in power suits and hyperspace being a hellish spirit world. It is even the plce the term "grimdark" may have originated from due to a line something like "In the grim dark future there is nothing but war.".

And from my research (that was prompted by WH40K crossover fics) "crunch" means the gameplay statistics, while "fluff" refers to story elements that give background but ultimately do not affect gameplay.

The first WH40K fic I read was a MLP:FIM crossover. The God Emperor of Mankind gets turned into a pony - a female one at that (Celestia) - and starts genetically engineering a whole planet populated with ponies.

[world_eater]

The first WH40K fic I read was a MLP:FIM crossover. The God Emperor of Mankind gets turned into a pony - a female one at that (Celestia) - and starts genetically engineering a whole planet populated with ponies.


Oh my god.

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

I originally found it courtesy of TV Tropes.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/FanFic/TheGodEmpressOfPonykind

[world_eater]

I am thoroughly amazed. Maybe I should start trying to read fanfiction!

[(Anonymous)]

Tabletop gaming (board games, miniatures games, RPGs, etc.) tend to come by the term 'fluff' by a different derivation than most fandoms. In them, the 'crunch' is the rules and game mechanics that are the core of the experience, while the 'fluff' is the story elements around it that may or may not grab the imagination of the players, but doesn't have any effects on the actual way the game playes. (i.e. it doesn't matter that your WH40K commissar is madly in forbidden love with one of his Space Marines, you won't get any bonuses or penalties for it either way.) It doesn't indicate the tone of the 'fluff' at all -- it can be dramatic, heartwarming, silly, or whatever.

Most other fandoms come to 'fluff' from an entirely different angle -- it describes the tone of a work entirely, from the idea of being 'light and fluffy.' Which makes a certain amount of sense -- most books, TV shows, anime, or whatever don't have any need for the term 'crunch' because there's no rules or gameplay to them. So without crunch, there's no reason to label the fluff in opposition to it, and that frees up the term for other uses.

And thus we get one term meaning two things due to differing derivations. Language and fandom sure are complicated!

[world_eater]

Not sure why you explain that to me. (not angry, i know lack of smileys can be deceiving~)

[nyxelestia]

I didn't see the AYRT's post until now, but I suspect it would be for the benefit of others on this thread, because I now understand why fluff has taken on that meaning in Wh40k fandom, and why it's so different from other fandoms. (So on that note, feel free the ignore my other comment, I didn't realize that your fandom was a table-top game, or what 'fluff' would mean in a tabletop game.).

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, that's why I explained it -- that and the fact that I love spreading information that I'm not entirely sure everyone in a discussion already knows. If it came across as didactic, or saying what people already know, I'm sorry -- I just get carried away with fun things like sharing etymologies. (Seriously. I have weird ideas of fun.)

[nyxelestia]

a.) Never apologize for spreading information. You never know what other people don't know.

b.) I'm an amateur linguist. I fucking LOVE hearing about cultural context of words, etymologies, history, etc. :) I don't see what's so weird about that version of fun at all. :P

[mimi-sardinia.livejournal.com]

I have been drawn into a mild understanding of WH40K due to fanfic, and I will say the usage of "fluff" in it is substantially different to the fanfiction usage of it.

Though it does beg the question, can WH40K have fluff fluff? Or is the fluff too grimdark to be fluffy?

[world_eater]

I don't think you can do Wh40k 100% fluffy (like in the lighthearted stories with no angst sense), there's some cutesy bits to it (like epic bromances between the space marines) but if there's no death or despair... well being grimdark is kind of the whole point!

I think fluff as in stories without much plot are possible, though I'm not sure I understand what the criteria of stories like that are, since I've never heard it used like that before.