fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #336 ]

[ SECRET POST #336 ]

⌈ Secret Post #336 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Out again, Christmas shopping/making a buttload of cookies! You know what to do!

Last day to submit for next week!

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 00 secrets from Secret Submission Post #048.
Secrets Not Posted: 0 broken links, [ 1 ] not!secret, [ 1 ] not!fandom, [ 1 ] repeat.
Next Secret Post: Tomorrow, Saturday, December 7th, 2007.
Current Secret Submission Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Link please! :)

http://community.livejournal.com/dears/1442524.html

I don't want to start a whole fight long ass thread about this shit, but it's really annoying.

What was said in that was NOT racist. Reread it. It was pride, there's a difference

I've read it so many times my eyes bleed from the stupid and it's STILL fucking racist.

Besides, the person trashing the secret OP kindly ignored the other issues with Gackt, which DO affect his career, such as his voice sucking and his spitting upon Yoshiki's comeback and Miyavi's insane talent with his crap vocals. There's a reason Yoshiki and Miyavi ripped up the stage and Gackt didn't, and it likely wasn't that Gackt was more responsible not to do so, especially since the CD fell through AND Gackt is suspiciously absent from Myspace.

if you can point out the racist parts, then I might change my mind. HOWEVER, there was no sentence in there that said "the Japanese are better than so & so". He said the Japanese were great, not better.

Everyone has their own opinion, I respect that. I still think Gackt has a very strong, powerful, moving voice, & if people don't feel the same way, I don't give a flying fuck because I love him.
& how is he possibly "spitting" upon Yoshiki's comeback? I would love to know how that one came up.

& being at the S.K.I.N. concert, I feel they all equally did wonderful. No one better, no one worse.
& Gackt never had a myspace o_O It wasn't him, it wasn't official myspaces.

Quote:

G : You can say that it’s something we feel as Japanese people. It’s like the way the sea in Japan feels really cold, unlike the seas in other countries. Even the forests and everything else; there is a darker, scarier green compared with overseas. I wonder why. Maybe it’s because more of what we call Japan’s colour is there.

Here, he's saying that Japan has unique physical and tangible characteristics that are better than those of other nations and unique only to it. Ethnocentrism at its worst. Look at what he's saying here, even the air and water and forests are "better"?

Quote:

I : You like things which has a Japanese spirit, don’t you?

G : Yes, I like them! I like Japan’s Bushido! Other countries don’t have this…I think that Japan’s Bushido is a spirit that came about because the Japanese are what they are. For it to become something firm, I really think that the men must protect this spirit. Japan is now heading towards a strange direction because we are forgetting this, isn’t it? If we lose the spirit of Bushido, our religion will be less closely related to our lives. In other countries, the religion is closely related to their everyday lives, and their faith educates them. Don’t we learn our morals and ethics from the teachings of our religion? In Japan, the adults should naturally pass this on to the children through the spirit of Bushido, but this is disappearing recently, and there are more children who don’t know these moral and ethics. I think this is a very scary thing. When you talk about this to them, you feel them thinking ‘What are you talking about?’, right? When we are around 15,16 years old, we go through our confused years, and we learn from the people who have walked down the road before us, in more ways than one. Especially when we get beaten up. Furthermore, corporal punishment is wrong, using force is wrong…the teachers now cannot do anything against the students. This is partly due to the media over-sensationalizing the news, and thanks to that, the things that originally had to be done are now all lost. Then, when faced with the fact that juvenile crime is on the rise, the media again condemns them, right? They say things like young people nowadays are like this, or like that. Weren’t you all the ones who caused this? You people created a system which raised young people like that. I always think that it’s really strange. My nephew is currently attending middle school, and what he tells me that the PTA[2] is strange. He said that the teachers cannot get angry at the students.

A typical right-wing racist rant. I mean, switch out "Christian" for "Bushido" and you have the KKK and Bushies.

& where exactly does he actually use the word "better"? He never said that Japan's feeling was better than other countries, he said they were different. How is that racist?

First off, Gackt is Japanese. I wouldn't blame him for taking pride in his "Japanese spirit". He said that Japan is losing the Bushido spirit, & he feels that people should know about it. It's not like he's going & saying "every Japanese person should know about the Bushido spirit because we're Japanese, I'm Gackt, & I say so." He said that Japanese people should know about it is all

Quote:

& where exactly does he actually use the word "better"? He never said that Japan's feeling was better than other countries, he said they were different. How is that racist?

You're arguing semantics. He implied that he sees Japan as better than anywhere else in the world, and that is exactly what Japan's right-wing racists claim. By establishing the "superiority" of his nation. . . he's being a racial supremacist.

Quote:

First off, Gackt is Japanese. I wouldn't blame him for taking pride in his "Japanese spirit". He said that Japan is losing the Bushido spirit, & he feels that people should know about it. It's not like he's going & saying "every Japanese person should know about the Bushido spirit because we're Japanese, I'm Gackt, & I say so." He said that Japanese people should know about it is all

Like there's any lack of teaching or knowledge on it? And seriously, taking pride in one's "Japanese spirit" is as offensive as taking pride in one's white skin color.

Did you just decide he's "implying" it? He never said it. He never said

"It’s like the way the sea in Japan feels really cold, unlike the seas in other countries. Even the forests and everything else; there is a darker, scarier green compared with overseas-- Japan's feeling is better than other countries feelings"

If he added that, then yes, it would come off as being slightly racist. Even if he did say that, I still don't think it would come off as too offensive, unless he pointed out that all the Japanese people were better than every other nationality.

How do you know there's lack of teaching or knowledge? Do you live in Japan? Do you witness it everyday on the Japanese streets, in the school, in the homes? He's ALWAYS in Japan, & maybe he has come across people that know nothing about it at all. But STILL, even with that, it's NOT racism.

I can see how you're looking at this, but I also see some other ways of looking at it that seem just as logical/likely. Let's keep in mind that Japanese spirituality mixes/matches Shinto, Buddhist, Christian, and Confucian beliefs and worship in a much more integrated and diverse way than one sees in US culture with equally divergent religions. So it really isn't accurate to think "Christian" is equivalent to "Bushido" in this quote.

Two examples of "Bushido" lost:

1. My own people (not surprising that we leap to our own POV, is it?) - Irish - Whether you argue the cause as choice or force, the Irish immigrants to the US dumped their culture, including the religion, morals, ethics, and language to become part of what is now referred to as "white." Now I'm not saying there's anything wrong with being white or that it's a horrible burden, just pointing out that the Irish (and surely other peoples) lost their "Bushido" in the process of assimilation, and that's sad. It is my earnest hope that more recent US immigrant groups fare better in this respect.

2. Visiting the Appalachian region of Kentucky, it was striking to notice how different the people in young, middle-age, elder generations are. The regional spirit is indeed being lost (along with some really cool dialects). And, religion has been an integral part of this culture/spirit. So, as the WalMartization/genericizing of the US continues, the regional churches sure *are* losing their congregations, and as a result, the population is losing the cultural communication that the churches once provided. For better or for worse, this region's cultural identity is in danger of extinction. (FYI, if you have to attend a cultural "festival" to experience your culture, I'm still calling it extinction.)

Now you may agree or disagree with the messages being conveyed by any given religious organization. It would be silly though, to ignore broader cultural impacts not directly related to specific religious beliefs.

If religious events are gathering places for a people, and if religion is how a culture communicates/educates/socializes, then YES, you will need new social infrastructure if the religion is lost. Sure it can be done - but what's lost? (or what risks being lost?)

Worldwide communication, media, and cultural cross-pollination carries a lot of benefits, but also some potential pitfalls, including loss of existing culture. Wanting to keep your culture or religion isn't racist. It's not not even objectionable.

No need to like Gackt or agree with him, of course...but let's be fair.

Edited 2007-12-08 09:45 (UTC)

*claps* Well said, I thank you

I read both parts of the translated article and didn't feel Gackt was being racist either. IMO he was trying to explain what made Japan special and those passages about the seas, air, and forests ring true for me.

And according to this site (http://victorian.fortunecity.com/duchamp/410/bsamurai.html) the seven basic principles of bushido are:

1. Gi: the right decision, taken with equanimity, the right attitude, the truth. When we must die, we must die. Rectitude.
2. Yu: bravery tinged with heroism.
3. Jin: universal love, benevolence toward mankind; compassion.
4. Rei: right action--a most essential quality, courtesy.
5. Makoto: utter sincerity; truthfulness.
ó. Melyo: honor and glory.
7. Chugo: devotion, loyalty.

"Compassion", "courtesy", "sincerity"...these aren't exactly cornerstones of the Klan or the Bushies, are they?

And while I normally love Gackt's music, I thought he's been a bit rudderless since Diabolos. Enough with the slow emo ballads already...hopefully he'll keep making great tunes with intricate, complex lyrics again sometime soon!

Actually, in internal documents and such, a lot of racist and right-wing groups make a big deal about honor and love and rightness and courtesy and loyalty and blah blah blah. The problem is, all of this is only toward their members and people they like, and any objective external view shows them to be bigoted, racist, and the exact opposite of what they claim they are defending internally.

But everyone who automatically believes in these ideas isn't a racist, and separating the good from the bad isn't difficult. The only way is to see what individuals do, and Gackt's the exact opposite of those hate-filled bigots. Why not give him the benefit of the doubt on this one?

Re: A Random Comment or Two....

pretentioustfu.livejournal.com - 2007-12-08 15:47 (UTC) - Expand

Hmmm... you're probably going to hit me... but the 'racist' statements in this are very-much subject to interpretation. I'm not wanting to start an argument and I fully respect your views, I just want to get a word in before this whole thread erupts in utter wank and silliness.

I think the first statement is pretty-much harmless. It is very patriotic, but still can be seen as simply cultural pride. It may just be that he's proud of his country and wants to convey that. I'm not a supremacist, I don't even have a huge amount of love for Britain. But it's still my homeland and I have a right to be proud of some of its unique differences to other countries. This does not mean that 'my country is better than yours'.

As for the second statement, whilst echoing a similar hard-line evangelical view prevalent in the USA, is not quite the same. Sure Gackt is obviously quite religious and eager to put across his view on such things. However, calling this 'racist' is technically wrong. If anything, this attitude would be described as being religiously discriminate (as opposed to race discriminate). However, it is not fair to compare Bushido to Christianity in that way. I am sure there are some fanatical sects in the Bushido culture (there are bound to be in any religion). But it's not as if he's saying his way is the only way (as many American Evangelicals would). He seems to be putting forward a suggestion that kids are not being taught the correct morals these days and this is because religion is becoming detached from everyday life. He is being no-more religiously fanatic than your everyday concerned Christian, Muslim or Jew. He is also protesting the growing Political Correctness of our current culture. I do not agree with his view that religion would solve this, but this statement still does not make him a racist.

The point is, his views may have some aspects similar to those of the right-wing supremacists and whack-jobs, but this does not necessarily mean he is one.
While appreciating Gackt's music and his good-looks, I still think the guy is terribly up-himself. He's vain. That's a fact. It was wrong of him to complain about Yoshiki. He is obviously quite a jealous man as well. In this aspect I am in complete agreement with you. However, calling him a 'racist' is not wholly accurate.

Quote:

As if it hasn't already? *laughs* But I won't hit you, I'm not the S-type ~_^. And you do make some good points, yet. . .

In almost any other country or contextual setting, I'd agree the first quote isn't necessarily racist, but at worst nationalistic patriotism. However, in Japan, racism and nationalistic patriotism are inextricably linked, AND this is the same sort of thing the racist right-wing nutjobs there have spewed for years. When it's coming from a sound stage rather than a sound truck, it's just that much more sad and stupid.

The problem is that in Japan, all of these issues are tied together. Since it's believed that only "the Japanese" (which doesn't include anyone from Zainichi Koreans to Chinese to anyone with non-Japanese national origin or appearance features) can truly practice Shinto or Bushido, that automatically makes them "superior." If the beliefs opened up, then this would not be racist, but it's like if fundamentalist Christianity had an "only white people may apply" sign on it.

Quote:

While appreciating Gackt's music and his good-looks, I still think the guy is terribly up-himself. He's vain. That's a fact. It was wrong of him to complain about Yoshiki. He is obviously quite a jealous man as well. In this aspect I am in complete agreement with you.

*nods* I think he's very pretty, and I loved his music up until 2005 when he seemed to take a fast dive off the slope and into the crap pile (seriously, if you hear his recorded vocals from SKIN, you'll see why Yoshiki got so mad: Gackt wasn't even trying and did things like tilting his head toward the ceiling that made what voice he had *worse,* IMO, and let's not even mention the disaster that was "No ni Saku Hana no you ni").

But yeah, that loss of actual talent and apparently even of his drive to "try" is what made me see him as "worse," since yes, Yoshiki is the king of angst and the prince(ss) of attention whores on occasion (LOL dolls of himself and amethyst blood and X condoms, though he's toned it down a bit since the X days) but he's capable of backing up all the self-promotion and attention-seeking with true talent and seems to want to give of himself for the fans, which Gackt, anymore, just doesn't seem like.

Quote:

However, calling him a 'racist' is not wholly accurate.

Maybe, maybe not, but I hope you can see why I think he is now ^_^

Oh and he spat on Yoshiki's comeback by providing substandard vocals that aren't even as "good" as his usual, by insisting on songs that didn't take full advantage of Yoshiki's (and Myv's for that matter) talent, AND by hogging the spotlight as he normally does AND by making the concert All About Him (tm). S.K.I.N was NOT a "Gackt concert" and yet he tried to make it one.

I find it interesting that Yoshiki's reaction was similar to that at the X Japan Last Live, where he's later said that he wanted to beat up Toshi but tore up the drums instead. ~~And that Miyavi joined in, oh, they make a perfect couple, don't they?~~

As for Gackt's myspace, he SHOULD have one. With all his ego-whoring and self-promotion, he is a perfect fit for Myspace. Why does he not? Maybe since Yoshiki, Miyavi, and Sugizo wouldn't friend him and told him as much. . . which would break down the "tatemai" of a mutual wandering off to other projects that currently covers over the CD nonrelease and Yoshiki and Myv's tantrum, were it known, so he decided not to open up that can of worms by not getting one.

Oh yeah? Is there an article or video to proof this?

He SHOULD have one, but he never did.
So you're going to tell me that Gackt is the only one in the world that tries to self-promote & has a large ego. You're making it sound like Gackt is the ONLY person that would ever "whore" himself out in the media. Yoshiki came up with Jrock Revolution, & to make the band S.K.I.N., that's not "whoring" himself out? He's not getting noticed more because of X Japan's reunion. It's a lame comeback.

Edited 2007-12-08 05:55 (UTC)

I'm not saying Gackt is the only self-promoter with a large ego. You took my words out of context: I'm trying to say that all the other self-promoters with large egos (Yoshiki and Miyavi) DO HAVE MYSPACES. That was my point.

I'm NOT saying Yoshiki can't be a media whore. I'm saying he may be one, but he still has the talent to back it up. As does Myv. Gackt doesn't, and I wish his fans would admit that.

& Yoshiki & Miyavi having myspaces just prooves they're just as much attention whores as Gackt is. But you're making like Gackt makes everything 'me, me, me' when the same thing can be said about both Yoshiki & Miyavi. I don't think it's fair to just point fingers at Gackt, saying that he's makes S.K.I.N. all about him, because being in the audience, that was NOT the case, & when I read an article or find a video with proof to back up with what you said before, then I'll believe it.

& who are you to say Gackt still doesn't have talent. It's your opinion, not everyone feels the same way you do.

GACKT IS THE GREATEST PERSON ON THE FACE OF THE EARTH. He has more talent in his pinky finger than Yoshiki & Miyavi have together.

I think my opinion is just as fair as yours :)

I'm butting in.

No way if fucking hell did he hog the spotlight in that concert. WHERE YOU EVEN THERE?? Yoshiki got mentioned a thousand times and played piano along with him. This concert made everyone look equally great! I'm a Yoshiki fan and I would be pissed if it was as you say, but it WAS NOT.

And stop defending yourself after making the retard mistake of saying Gackt has a myspace. In your last entry about him being "racist" everyone already said he doesn't have a myspace, yet you keep mentioning it. Will you get it through your head??

Thank you, Mari.

From reading this, I don't believe that they were even at the concert, & are just throwing anything out to make themselves look right, but it all honestly, it just sounds more stupid.

I think anyone who complains & bitches about Gackt getting the spotlight doesn't really, you know, understand what happened at the concert:
1- they were all equally great. all of them were beyond amazing, & I'm shocked that they can just take the audiences breath away in just one hour.
2- Some people have to understand: GACKT IS THE SINGER. Does that mean he deserves more attention than everyone else? Absolutely not. BUT, when someone is speaking or singing, usually they do get a lot of attention. Gackt happened to be the person who talked throughout the whole concert, so it's hard not to focus on him. But at the concert, not everything was GACKT.

Yoshiki got just as much attention as Gackt did. Afterall, Gackt did keep telling him to play those damn drums xD
You understand what I mean, right? I never went & said Gackt was the only part of S.K.I.N.

I love them all, the reason why I praised Gackt was because pretenwtfever kept bashing down on him & said that his fans should get over him. As a fan, I'm not going to let that go just because they say so. He has no right to make opinions for others.
& also, they are putting words in Gackt's mouth about S.K.I.N., because they haven't shown any proof whatsoever that Gackt actually said "Everything about S.K.I.N. is ME". They're just trying to come up with really bad comebacks.

& fyi, if anyone shoots out a "that's their opinion" about the whole racist thing, racism CANNOT be an opinion. He either is or he isn't, & clearly, they can't come up with any good proof that what he said was racism, only that Gackt is "implying" it. They would know, they like, totally hang out with Gackt everyday, so they know.

You're right, I wasn't at the concert, but I've seen video of it. And I'd really like it if you would stop putting words in my mouth and accusing me of false things.

"AND Gackt is suspiciously absent from Myspace."

Those are your words, and you're saying he has a myspace.

Enough said.

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A Random Comment or Two....

Re: A Random Comment or Two....

Re: A Random Comment or Two....

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