[ SECRET POST #3132 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3132 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 068 secrets from Secret Submission Post #448.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Re: Tolkien fandom

[(Anonymous)]

It's the same for anything where some people need to feel better than others. He's probably a sad little man in real life.

Re: Book vs movie - I can see where people come from on this. I mean I would never say that movie fans aren't "real" fans but it does feel like we're fans of very different things. It's easy to take something personally when the media means so much to you, and I know I am very frustrated by a lot of PJ's choices and how those choices are now more main-stream than what's actually in the book.

I mean, I like that he did a little towards individualizing the characters. I am happy to view Dwalin as a big scary second-in-command. But it's also clear that PJ didn't care about or didn't understand the details of Middle-earth. It would be one thing if it served the story but, for instance, having Nori be a thief doesn't serve any narrative function and actually doesn't make sense when they need Bilbo to be a thief. And now it's just ingrained so that if I look for a fic with him, he's going to always be a thief. Rarely does an author make their own Nori. From the book, you can do practically anything you want with this character but he now has a generally-agreed-upon characterization and you'd have to state if you're deviating from that. So, that can be sad for book!fans.

I believe that the Hobbit films were for the most part enjoyable but they were not to the level of LOTR. If they had been, I don't think there would be so many book!fans pushing so hard back against the movies. If, for instance, Tauriel had been written without the romance (or the romance hadn't been so clunky), more people would have been okay with her.

At least that's how I view it. I heard a film critic once say that if a movie adaption is great, then the fans won't nitpick about the details (generally. there's always going to be that one guy). But if the film isn't good, then fans will nitpick to death. I think there may be a grain of truth in that.

(BTW, congrats on finishing your test!)

Re: Tolkien fandom

[philstar22]

Thanks! And I do agree with you (although in this case the discussion was strictly about LOTR and not Hobbit too). I think the books are better by far, though I still love all the movies (to differing degrees). I just don't believe in insulting other fans because we're all fans. And the funny thing was some people made Silmarillion references and this guy didn't recognize them, so he clearly hadn't read all the books. So by some people's standards he wouldn't be a real fan either. He was just being rude and it was uncalled for.

Re: Tolkien fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I always equate these people with conspiracy-theory types. I once saw a documentary disproving all the 9/11 conspiracy theories, and in the documentary one of the talking heads said that it doesn't matter what evidence you provide because what these people really want is to be right and to know something others don't. Or to see something others don't. It makes them special, makes them unique. So no amount of evidence will be good enough because they're not out for the truth, despite what they say. They just need to keep feeling oppressed or in-the-know or whatever it is that's really motivating them.

This made so much sense to me, and made it clear that engaging with these people is a waste of time because it doesn't matter what you say. They have to be right. They have to be better than you. It's not about the truth at all.

So, it's good to put the evidence out there and then walk away. (I agree it can be frustrating though when you're looking for a nice place to debate and/or squee.)

Re: Tolkien fandom

[(Anonymous)]

Eh, to be fair in the book the dwarves really aren't fleshed out, so it's not a surprise people would gravitate to the movie characters because there's more to work with. Characters like Nori still have a lot of areas where people can fill in the blanks. Hobbit fandom is mostly movie based so not surprised people stick to movie characterization. Doesn't bother me, since it's different.

Re: Tolkien fandom

[(Anonymous)]

I don't have any issue with people using the movie characterization. I understand that. But I have an issue when the movie gets something fundamentally WRONG about a character. For instance, it explicitly states in UT that Thranduil does not harbor anti-Silvan feelings. That is the exact opposite of who he is.

But that crops up in a lot of fics. Same with Nori being a thief or being poor (or that he and his brothers have different fathers - that idea needs to die in a fire). Most likely, he is of the royal lineage of Durin (only Bofur, Bombur and Bifur are not, and they are likely an honor guard). I agree that he can be fleshed out further but the basis of the character that people are using goes against what Tolkien stated. That he gave so little and still PJ couldn't honor that is very frustrating to those of us who love the books.