fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #3168 ]

[ SECRET POST #3168 ]

⌈ Secret Post #3168 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02.

[Criminal Minds]

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03.

[Community]

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04.

(Harry Potter, Yu-Gi-Oh)

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05.

[JerryC]

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06.

[J.K. Rowling/Harry Potter]

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07.

[Kingdom Hearts: Dream Drop Distance]

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08.

[Hatfields & McCoys]

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09.

[Proof]

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10.

[Brooklyn Nine Nine]

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11.

[Scarlett Johansson]

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12.

[No Escape]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 065 secrets from Secret Submission Post #453.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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Star Wars fandom

Just…Star Wars fandom

Oh how many examples I have:

-Anakin in Attack of the Clones is called a stalker because he looks at Padmé after she tells him to stop but when Han Solo presses Leia up against a wall and kisses her after she tells him to stop touching her hands, it's sexy

-When Anakin kills people out of anger, he's beyond the pale but when Luke does it, it doesn't mention a peep

I'm talking about Anakin killing the sand people after his mother is killed versus Luke shooting the stormtroopers after Obi-Wan is killed. And you might very well say that the sand people included the children -- and I agree that's completely wrong. But look at what Anakin went through -- he spent a month having horrific visions of his mother being tortured and arrives for her to die in his arms while the perpetrators are outside -- people who would have heard her scream and did nothing. He doesn't know WHO specifically is responsible. Is it any wonder he loses it?

Luke, meanwhile, watches Obi-Wan die. And yes, that's horrible -- but how long has he known Obi-Wan? He didn't even know the guy was a Jedi until a few days ago. And Obi-Wan clearly LETS Vader kill him. Luke is upset and so when Obi-Wan is killed, he opens fire on Vader and the stormtroopers. And he keeps shooting, even when Leia and Han and begging him to go. He doesn't stop until Obi-Wan's voice tells him to go. And the thing of it is -- those stormtroopers -- they didn't kill Obi-Wan. And Luke didn't have to kill them -- he could have left while his friends were begging him to go. But he still killed them out of anger. He didn't care that they might have been conscripted on the pain of death -- he was angry and even though he could have left, they were the enemy so he killed them.

I'm not saying that what Luke did is as bad as Anakin, but I feel like Anakin at least has way more emotional trauma to justify his bloodlust and he at least recognizes it was wrong. While Luke -- no one mentions it at all.

Or Padmé. Padmé gets criticized for marrying Anakin -- someone who had saved her planet, saved her life, and was going off to protect the Republic in the Clone Wars whom she KNEW had lashed out in a moment of extreme emotional distress. And, yes, she was foolhardy.

But why does Leia -- who goes for Han -- never get criticized. Han worked for a slaver -- Jabba the Hutt -- and shows no remorse for his actions. In fact, when they go to rescue Han, Luke, Leia and company blow up the sail barge -- as though there weren't any slaves on it at all -- even though we KNOW Jabba has slaves. They don't seem to care about innocent causalities here at all. But the Jedi in the prequels will get raked over the coals for it.

I could go on but I think I've written enough...

I agree with a lot of this. I feel like people have such massive nostalgia goggles and such disproportionate prequel hate that they won't criticize OT characters and over emphasize flaws of prequel characters.

Star Wars characters have always been flawed, which is part of what makes them interesting in spite of being archetypes.

See, the thing is, I don't hate any of the OT characters but I feel like they get a pass on so much that the prequel characters don't. And it often comes across like I'm bashing them but I'm NOT. I just want to point out that they're not as perfect as the fandom likes to portray them as.

Like, I completely recognize that what Anakin did at the Tusken camp was 100% wrong. But it's so insanely traumatizing that I can't help but feel that at least mitigates some of his culpability. Is there any one of us who can say with 100% certainty that if someone we loved was tortured to death that we wouldn't lose our shit?

And what's worse, for me, is that Anakin DOES do what he's supposed to do -- he confides in someone he trusts, someone in authority -- but that person is Palpatine. Anakin told a person in power/authority about what he had done and I'm sure that Palpatine reassured him and used that to his own ends.

I just feel like people try to paint Anakin as a monster for it -- and while I agree that it was a monstrous act, I don't think it's beyond the realm of how an ordinary person might react to such utterly horrific circumstances.

I agree with you. I think people take that incident out of context. I love most Star Wars characters and all of the movies. I love the universe. I'm a bit meh on bounty hunters, but I can't think of a character I actively hate. And I genuinely don't get the prequel hate in the extremes that it exists in or that people speak about these movies being bad as if it were objective fact.

Part of the tragedy of Anakin is that he trusts the wrong person and that he has these two influences in his life (Obi-Wan and Anakin) and that Obi-Wan kind of screws up and is not the best mentor he could be. Not that this justifies everything, but it is all part of the context. Obi-Wan knows he screwed up, he even says so in the OT that people idolize so much.

That's another thing that frustrates me -- while I completely agree that Anakin's actions are 100% his own and that they aren't Obi-Wan's responsibility, I DO think the fact that Anakin and Obi-Wan's relationship was so bad is mostly Obi-Wan's fault (with some on Palpatine and a little on Qui-Gon).

Anakin was 9 years old when they met. And the fact that Anakin can't go to Obi-Wan for things -- that's not Anakin's fault. And yet when people start bashing Anakin for how his relationship with Obi-Wan turned out, it makes me angry.

There's a reason Anakin turned to Palpatine -- and poor Obi-Wan couldn't have known he was a Sith Lord but it's clear that he was okay with Anakin going to see Palps to fill that gap in his life.

I don't expect Obi-Wan to be perfect but I get tired of seeing Anakin blamed for this. Fandom never wants to hear of it though because Anakin is "an annoying brat."

Yes, completely agreed. Obi-Wan is one of my favorite Star Wars characters, but I love him because he's complicated. I think it is part of the nostalgia goggles that people don't want to hate on him for anything, but the funny thing is he even admits that he wasn't ready to be a teacher or mentor in the OT (although in ROTJ which some extreme haters tend to lump in with the prequels and claim only the first two are good).

Yeah, I love Obi-Wan too. He's a wonderfully three-dimensional character and Ewan really, really leant him great depth and complexity.

But the people who elevate him to saint-like levels really get on my nerves. I'm not the type to blame him for Anakin's actions because Anakin himself hid a lot of stuff from Obi and, at the end of the day, Obi-Wan is NOT responsible for another person's actions.

But there is a tendency to go "Oh, poor put-upon Obi-Wan having to deal with bratty little Anakin" and it kind of pisses me off because Anakin in The Phantom Menace was a sweet little boy who wanted to help people. And Obi-Wan basically RAISED him. If Anakin's being a little shit to him…well…guess who's to blame?

I'm not the type to blame him for Anakin's actions ... Obi-Wan is NOT responsible for another person's actions.

If Anakin's being a little shit to him…well…guess who's to blame?

To HIM being the key words.

Like I said…I don't blame Obi-Wan for Anakin's actions -- but I do blame him for having a bad relationship with Anakin.

Obi-Wan isn't responsible for Anakin's turn, for the Tusken slaughter, for Anakin killing the Jedi.

But Anakin talking back to Obi-Wan? Anakin not being able to confide in Obi-Wan? That I do think is Obi-Wan's responsibility -- he was Anakin's guardian and part of being a guardian is disciplining the child in your care.

ayrt Are you a parent yourself?

No. I have a significantly younger brother though.

I have a great relationship with him because I reach out to him and call him every week. We talk about his favorite video games and school and so he comes to me with problems and issues.

My sister, on the other hand, basically completely ignores him even though she's only one year old than him.

I live hours and hours away from him. She lives less than two.

How you treat a child has a huge effect on your relationship with them. The fact that my brother has a terrible relationship with my sister is her fault. The fact that he loves me, confides in me, and trusts me is because I reach out to him and show how much I care about him. He knows he can rely on me and that I'd do anything for him.

Also, I look at Anakin and Obi-Wan's relationship similarly to how my sister hates our father -- she has good reason to and the fact that her relationship with our father is so bad is HIS fault 100%.

SA

*sorry, I should say that my sister is only one year older than me

We're both significantly older than our brother (by over a decade)

ayrt Fair enough :)

Ehhh The Clone Wars shows a much different relationship between them. I feel like Obi-Wan did pretty well with him, all things considered, and it eventually blossomed into a very strong friendship. But Anakin has always had a very ideal set of views about teh Jedi and such and I think that tainted things for him and what with Palpatine manipulating him and his world essentially turning upside down once he started training, well...Anakin was gonna have problems either way.

BUT, Obi-Wan was also very much a follower of the Jedi. So much so, that his own romantic leanings left him very conflicted and such, not to mention his attachment to Anakin and his never gotten over bitterness with Qui-Gon's death and subsequent request to train this young boy who he didn't know and didn't trust and didn't believe could be trained successfully with his already preconceived views, etc etc. Obi-Wan, is, as you said, very complicated, but I don't necessarily believe his relationship with Anakin was bad. Just that...certain personal things anakin couldn't discuss because he knew Obi-Wan would most likely have done the right thing by Jedi standards and ousted him. Or if he didn't, he'd have been even MORE conflicted, on top of his OWN feelings regarding Satine and then everything ELSE going on.

....I need to rewatch that show. Liek now. >_>

SA

Oh -- and the way the Star Wars fandom treats George Lucas.

Seriously, it's disgusting. The man is a fucking saint from what I can tell. He's donating billions to charity. He has a great focus on education (I remember Dan Carlin talking about working with Lucas' Edutopia to talk about teaching history). He is, by all accounts, a WONDERFUL father -- his children adore him and have defended him on twitter against assholes in the fandom.

But -- OH NOES -- he made some movies some people didn't like and he tweaked some of his old movies. TEH HORROR. TEH HORROR.

Seriously, the Star Wars fandom needs to grow the fuck up.

They'll treat Harrison Ford like he fucking walks on water even though the guy shook the hand of a man that held down and sodomized a 13 year old girl he'd drugged.

LIke WHY THE FUCK is George Lucas included on this list:

Hitchcock: Harassing actress Tippi Hedren on set
Woody Allen: Marrying his adopted daughter
Griffith: Glorifying the Ku Klux Klan
Riefenstahl: Supporting Hitler and the Third Reich
Polanski: Fleeing the country before standing trial for drugging and raping a thirteen-year-old
Lucas: Pissing on his own legacy

WHY THE FUCK IS LUCAS ON THAT LIST?!? Fuck these people.

http://www.complex.com/pop-culture/2013/02/10-great-directors-who-have-done-terrible-things/george-lucas

"Done terrible things" MY ASS

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[ SECRET POST #3168 ]

Re: Disproportionate fandom reactions

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