[ SECRET POST #3327 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3327 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.


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02.
[Leonard Snart/Ray Palmer, DC's Legends of Tomorrow]


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03.


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04.


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05. [SPOILERS for Downton Abbey]





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06.[WARNING for suicide]



[Mare Internum]


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07. [WARNING for sexual assault]



[Love Live - sorry anon who wanted it Saturday, trying to keep the warning ones on Friday]


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08. [WARNING for rape, abuse, etc]





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09. [WARNING for rape/dub-con, child abuse]





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10. [WARNING for rape]





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11. [WARNING for underage sex]






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12. [WARNING for sexual abuse, child abuse]




























Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #475.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[sachiko_san]

I took it from the discussion of 70's groupie culture that happened in that thread. And even if there was no fake ID, she probably lied about her age anyway, so how was he supposed to know? He wasn't psychic and it was only a one time thing.

Well good thing she said she enjoyed her experience so we have first hand knowledge, so we shouldn't be trying to say she was raped and we shouldn't be saying Bowie is a rapist when she actively sought him out, probably lied about her age, and consented to sleeping with him.

[nonnymouscawitz]

My mom grew up in the late 70s and 80s, and I actually called her that night to talk to her about it. She says that not only was it groupie culture, but it was also very common in general for 15 year olds to be seen as old enough to consent. Though I'm not comfortable just assuming she lied, I stick to only facts I have sources for.

If Bowie knew she was fifteen, I'm perfectly comfortable saying that it was gross of him to sleep with her, but I am still not willing to call it rape when she herself does not. If she was still 15 then I'd question whether or not she was capable of making that decision (15 is a weird age where I think they're too old for me to be telling them what to do with their bodies, but I also don't think they're at an age where I would lower the age of consent and let adults sleep with them) but she's got to be in her 50s now and old enough to interpret her own situation.

[sachiko_san]

Well is just goes to show people saw teenagers as more mature back then than they do now.

You can say if all you want, but the truth was he probably didn't know or the culture was just all for turning a blind eye, but if he saw no reason to question her age, then what's the problem? She presented herself as an adult, so there probably was no if about it. Bowie isn't gross because he unknowingly slept with a minor, he would be if he knew her real age, but he didn't.

[nonnymouscawitz]

I agreed with that in my last reply. I said I'd have no problem calling him gross if he knew she was fifteen, but we don't have any way of knowing that.

I do take issue with 'she presented herself as an adult' though, because that is frequently used by child molesters to describe their underage victims who weren't growing up in 70s groupie culture and aren't happy with their assault. If she was in a club or had a fake ID then he had no way of knowing, but just 'she acted grown up' is a bit of a flimsy defense. I acknowledge that I may be being oversensitive, but it's a sensitive issue.

[sachiko_san]

You are being oversensitive about this. The situation with Bowie is in no way comparable to child molestation. The girl lied about her age to sleep with him and was a teenager, he did not know this, he did not pursue a relationship with her, and the girl enjoyed her experience and wasn't traumatized.

Child molesters purposely seek out children to prey on them and say things like the child was trying to seduce them to make themselves seem like the victim. These situations are nothing alike and will never be alike unless the adult in both situations knows the actual age of the minor they slept with.

[nonnymouscawitz]

I'm not comparing the situation with Bowie to child molestation, I am saying that the phrase 'she acted like an adult' has unfortunate connotations, which was an issue with your phrasing and not the Bowie situation.

Although I AM getting a little frustrated that no matter how many times I say 'I agree, if she led him to believe he was older, it's not his fault he's not psychic' you seem determined to argue with me about how it's not his fault if he didn't know which is... exactly what I've been saying.

[sachiko_san]

Yes, an unfortunate phrase, but what what was he supposed to think when she looks more an adult than a child and it was a place one wouldn't expect to see a child and she's a groupie?

Because most of what you said did not come off that way to me and the fact that you keep replying and your replies come off as "but-but-but-!"

[nonnymouscawitz]

It's just a phrase I am uncomfortable with. It has nothing at all to do with Bowie and what happened. And I am perfectly ok with it being a case of me being oversensitive.

I think you should go back and reread because everything I wrote was 'If Bowie knew, gross, but if he didn't, not his fault.' I kept replying because your response to that was 'But if he didn't know it wasn't his fault' and I said 'Yes, I agree' and then you would reply and so on and so forth. EDIT: Looking back our conversation was a lot shorter than I thought it was but yes, I was saying from the beginning that it was only gross if he knew she was underage.

[sachiko_san]

That was my problem with the whole thing though, there probably was no if. It was David Bowie, not Jimmy Page (I believe I have the right person, the guy who was with that teenage girl and hid her until she was of age).

[nonnymouscawitz]

Yes, it is probable there was no if, but since we don't know for sure, it's perfectly reasonable to discuss the if. Hell, even if we 100% knew she personally showed him her ID and said 'I'm totes 18' it would still be perfectly within reason to say 'Well if he'd known she was underage it would be gross but since he didn't...' and in fact, that's likely exactly what I would say in that situation. Arguing about it is silly as we are literally saying the exact same thing with different words. Saying 'if he'd known it would be gross' does not retroactively make him know.

[sachiko_san]

Pretty much yeah.